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Should the State Pension be means tested?

THE UK state pension should be means tested and wealthy retirees should LOSE their entitlement to it completely, a top economic body has demanded.

The Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development believes “rich” Britons – millions of whom have paid into the system through National Insurance contributions for decades – should lose their pension entitlement entirely.

It said stopping state pensions for Britain’s richest 10 per cent of retirees would “free up resources” to pay more money, either to poorer pensioners or people on other benefits.

What are your views? Is it fair that pensioners who have contributed equally should be treated differently?

Should the State Pension by means tested?

3132 people have already voted, what's your opinion? Yes No

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mikemac
9th Oct 2019
0
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I am already deeply concerned about the state pension. It is being attacked and whittled away by successive UK Govts in Westminster by increasing the retirement age and it is already the lowest of any developed nation.

Since the above article, Ian Duncan Smith's think tank on pensions is promoting the idea of retirement age of 75. Many UK citizens will die before being eligible for a pension. It's not to the fore in people's minds because BREXIT is hogging every news programme or politics show but for many it is a disaster waiting to happen. People who are currently in their fifties could stand to lose more than £50,000 worth of pension. This is not an attack on Conservatives, though they are the main protagonist in this "theft", Labour and Lib Dems will not reverse or halt the decline and indeed mostly voted for it.

Someone argued that I would be OK because in an independent Scotland it won't happen and having researched into it I believe that to be true. Pensions will be safer up here in the event of independence but that's not the point. I am currently in the UK. I have friends and family who live in England and Wales who will be affected and there is no will in parliament to halt the decline.

If the government's recent record on PIP assessments is the yardstick for any means testing I would again be deeply concerned. people on their death beds being fined for non-attendance, terminally ill being declared fit for work and wounded veterans sleeping rough on the streets of our cities.

I have written to my MP regarding my concerns over pensions and I would suggest as many as possible should do likewise. People will lose their homes if this continues.
driver69
1st Dec 2017
0
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I have worked all my life a full time mom to three doing a full time job etc..I was not able to pay into a private pension so I now survive on state pension and pension credit..if I was to have a little job earning as little as five pounds per week my pension credit would be taken off me..BUT BUT BUT I have a few friends who are on disability (they are fitter than me) amounting to hundreds a month they still keep their pension credit with all the perks that go with it..WHY is this..I struggle to survive and yet I have worked all my life and not relied on goverment hand outs..they can have their heating on I sit in the cold until I cannt stand it anymore..they go out while I sit at home..This is unfair..
Angel9uk
1st Dec 2017
0
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Similar to me!!! But I can't even get pension credit because I have a small private pension of £60 per month, which brings me very slightly over the threshold. I therefore have to pay for everything - dental treatment, opticians etc. whilst those who didn't work and save get everything free. Very unfair!!!
driver69
1st Dec 2017
0
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well its terrible..they get pension/pension credit plus all this extra money..one has just given up the car and thats 250 per month being paid back into her bank..thats a lot more than your 60..she boasts about how much she puts into her isa account each month and in another account she has 5000 for her funeral..l believe l could not have more than 5000 so why is it she is allowed all this money..shes not taxed but if l had it lm sure l would be...l know there are folk out there that need this extra money for care etc but when its given and they dont need care its terrible no wonder this country is in the state it is..oh and by the way she worked until she had her first child at 18 and never worked again...what a moaner l am..but lm sure theres hundreds that think the same
Darthvadar
29th Jul 2017
0
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We have a problem for sure. People have not saved for pensions for decades. We have lived through times when pension provisions were often catered for by our employer,at least in part. Materially, we did not have as much or indeed expect as much. We paid the pensions of those that went before us and we now expect those tax payers of today to pay our pensions. Why should we expect less of the tax payers today? Society has changed however. People now question more and challenge authority. I believe that pensions should be paid as we believed they would for all of our working lives. Tax bands provide the answer,not means testing.
Yodama
7th Aug 2017
0
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Silverpostie
17th Jul 2017
2
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As a WASPI I have had my State Pension put back twice, I now expect it on my 66 birthday.
Imagine my blood pressure rise again again when I find the new pension from April 2016 means that even after 46 years contributions unless I contribute until April 2021 I will lose over £18 a week (this is also after the deduction for being contracted out). This new pension means you must continue working if you are able or pay voluntary contributions almost right up to your State Retirement Age!!! Please do a State Pension Forecast if you have taken early retirement man or woman
Barton babe
7th Jul 2017
1
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If you have payed your taxes, you should receive your full pension.
VeraS
20th May 2017
1
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Means test the pension when over seas aid to wealthy countries is means tested
CaroleAH
28th May 2017
0
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What a sensible suggestion!
iestynlad
19th May 2017
3
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We have PAID for this! I am a WASPI I have already lost £30k Theresa May should be ashamed of herself letting her generation of women down
sixtyplusvat
14th May 2017
0
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Child Benefit is means tested in the most stupid way! One partner earning over £50k loses the benefit altogether but a couple each earning £49k is entitled to the full amount!! How is that fair? Pensions as such are not a benefit as we have all paid into the system (in my case for 45 years!) However, I do think that those in receipt of several pensions and other income could probably be asked to donate a small percentage into the Social Care Fund.
Directext
13th May 2017
0
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People have worked hard and deserve all the benefits from that
Westminster
12th May 2017
3
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It is important to remember that the State Pension is added to other income to calculate one's income tax, so if a pensioner is paying higher rate tax 40% of the pension is recovered by the Government.

The Beveridge report of 1944 determined that benefits that are universally available are more acceptable to society.

We do not want different classes of pensioners, the existing system works we, 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it'.
Lionel
12th May 2017
1
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So well said. Thank you.
m209108
12th May 2017
0
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It should be optional for those who don't need it!
Niktaw
12th May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
We have paid into the system so we should take out when we are due to retire.
Darkstar
12th May 2017
2
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If you have paid into the state pension, you should get the same as everyone else. Why should people who have saved or earned good wages or salary have to suffer.
JanetP5
13th May 2017
1
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Totally agree. These people that can't be bothered to work get everything handed to them on a plate. If pensioners have worked all their live and paid in they are entitled to a state pension.
Hollik20
12th May 2017
0
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Irrespective of what other arrangements and savings have been made, if you pay in you should get the state pension. Otherwise you are penalising those that have sacrificed to save for their older years. It is unthinkable to have paid in and then be told you are not going to see a return.
igf2311
12th May 2017
3
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Whatever next!!!!! Sounds like another political 'con'. OK to state these things when you have a private pension lined up (maybe part of the perks of the job) and possibly adequate personal means. People, whether rich or poor, have paid into a system to provide state pensions, hopefully guaranteeing a state pension for them when they want or need to retire. Would anyone pay into a private pension only to be told that it will be 'means tested' at the end? What shall we 'means test' next? Perhaps the NHS will be the next in being recommended for means testing. we could ask sick people about their finances before we treat them, disgusting.
lizfid3
11th May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
If a person has worked hard and paid into the system why on earth should they be deprived of their pension? I'm not in the least wealthy but I do not grudge the wealthy, hard workers the fruits of their labours.
JudyB1
10th May 2017
0
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Everyone who earns a wage over a certain threshold pays their stamp for their state pension How can you then not allow them to have it?
Cactus14
8th May 2017
2
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No. Like most of the others I have worked all my life and have paid for my pension. Why should people who have paid their way all their working life be means tested.

The younger generation should be made to think about providing for themselves before it's to late.
MargaretM32
8th May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
The state pension is not a benefit it is judged on ni increments so if you have worked for 43 years as i have I shouldnt lose out because someone hasnt worked. Those who lost their right to work should be paid a benefit to supplement their income and their income equal tax free income. I will be paying tax for ever because I have worked since i was a teenager. The government have made a mess of changing the pension age especially for women who were given the choice of paying reduced ni stamps, they also seem to have forgotten the school leaving age was raised in 1973 to 16 which affected a lot of men and women
WendyG2
8th May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
Most people have worked hard and have paid their national insurance etc so if they have managed to save a little for a less stressful retirement why should they be penalised
Susanbennett1952
8th May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
I agree wholeheartedly with all of you silver surfers.
I have just retired after 48 years in one job & have paid in to the system all of that time.
Why should we be means
tested ?
mikzun
7th May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
I did my 50 years taxpayer/NI payer slavery why should i not get my pension.,
Some young folk today do not start work till their thirty!!, good luck to them, but don't whinge about my pension i earned whilst helping pay for your years of education through taxes.
imcdouga
7th May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
When will the government give us hard working contributors a break!!! I've paid into NI for 45 years and think I derserve my state pension...I was hoping to get it when I was 60, but due to changes I won't draw mine until I'm 66 !! If you have paid in then absolutely you deserve it...
Robcar
7th May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
I don't think it should be means-tested but those who say 'we've already paid for it' have got to be wrong. Even if you take the pension to be £130 per week, that means if you're female and live to 70 you'll have received nearly £70,000 - you wouldn't have paid in that much!!
Lionel
7th May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
None the less, this remains a contract between the State and the people.

One is compelled to pay in what the State demands over the course of a working life time, as well as a host of other taxes and at a point determined by the State, one may receive a pension from one's contributions.

It is an inviolable contract since a contract is only valid when money, or other transferrable assets, are exchanged. That is English Common Law under which the Pension provisions were written and passed into Law early in the 20th century. Revisions were made in the very early post war years to make pension provision more comprehensive.

That the scheme has been ignored or at best entirely mismanaged by successive governments with no more than a 5 year view is not the responsibility of generations of beneficiaries.

For myself I feel it would have been better to feed pension contributions into a sovereign wealth fund, invested very carefully, which am sure would have come very close to meeting pension provision. Norway has a similar arrangement for proceeds from North Sea oil and gas.

As it is, our pensions are a pittance when better management would have provided us with more disposable wealth to pour into the national economy.
Pennysalter
6th May 2017
3
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If we paid into our state pension fund, we should be entitled to our pension whether one is wealthy or poor.
butterfly1
6th May 2017
0
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YES FOR THE FILTHY RICH PEOPLE WITH A CERTAIN GUIDE FIGURE ? MILLIONS.
SOME OAP IN THIS COUNTRY STILL DO NOT RECEIVE THE BASIC PENSION, AND WHEN THEY SPOKE TO PENSION PEOPLE THEY ASKED THE QUESTION HOW MUCH SAVINGS DO YOU HAVE? WHY SHOULD THEY ASK THIS QUESTION TO AN 84 YEAR OLD LADY WHO DOES NOT EVEN HAVE THE BASIC PENSION? SHE IS LUCKY IF SHE HAS ANY SAVINGS NOW. CANNOT UNDERSTAND THE THINKING OF OUR TAX OFFICE.
patcaf
5th May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
The state pension is not a benefit. We have paid for it. It is our by right and should not be means tested.

What is a wealthy retiree anyway? Private pension of 30k, 40k, 50k? Where do you draw the line? Do you include the value of people's homes as that is where the wealth is for most people?
paulajean
5th May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
If people have paid their NI contributions for years then they should get their pension. They have paid for it. What they do with it is another question. They could give it away to worthy causes as I am sure some do.
[deleted]
5th May 2017
8
Thanks for voting!
Lionel
8th May 2017
2
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Well, Scandiman, it seems we are yet again in agreement. The State is the bugaboo not we the people.

The State is there to serve us, the people. I know that's difficult to believe today but it is a fact. The State has no funds and no power unless given it by the people. Ah, until we come to the Civil Service. The CS is the continuum that enables the wall between itself and the people of this nation; proof against changes of government, it just carries on, tempering and adjusting political intentions to suit itself. The State self perpetuates.

Very sadly the Church of England has become a vassal of State. Now we have no defence. Nowhere to hide.

I have a cousin, a Christian man as I am. Yet despite the Sermon on the Mount, despite Early Church writings warning against promulgating violence, he is a very highly paid senior weapons procurement officer for the MOD. He is a product of the State and will fare well in this life. I am not a product of State and am not faring quite so well.

Yet, I know whom I have believed ... and He warned against getting mixed up with the State. Indeed, it was the State that demanded His death. I'll continue with Him.
Lizzy36
4th May 2017
3
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It should not be means tested - however the way our contributions are used should change.
The contributions we paid I believe were used to pay for pensioners of the time..I guess our contributions far outweighed what was needed at the time, however the excess was not reserved it was spent on other things, and now we are coming to pensionable age our numbers far outweigh the current working generation.
Hence there is now a worry of how to fund.
SheilaR24
4th May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
We've contributed to the state pension over lots of years and we should get what we're owed, all of us. The talk has been about us pensioners getting more than youngsters but what is this? A race to the bottom.??
There has to be some equalisation in society and we all know that the gap between rich and poor. We all know that although legal, some corporate bodies don't pay taxes into the countries they are trading in. Also, some of this governments policies have definitely benefitted the rich and not the poor...
MorrisandDoris
4th May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
Definitely no , child allowance should be means tested !!
imcdouga
7th May 2017
1
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back in the good old days, you didn't get family allowance for the 1st child !!! Only 2nd child onwards....if we went back to this then maybe people would think twice before having children and expecting the government to fund their upbringing
LindaM119
4th May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
I've worked for years. Why should I be penalised now that I have retired. Already having to wait for it.
2
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It's already paid for in our deductions when we work a lifetime
Jo Kingham
4th May 2017
4
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No it shouldn't. We've paid in so we are entitled to it. I understand why things like child benefit are means tested and agree winter fuel benefits should be too, but these are benefits. Our pension is our right, we've contributed to it all our working lives.
Chris B
4th May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
Do not even go there! Why should hard working people who have been sensible and saved be penalised. Pension has been paid for it is not a benefit!! ☹️
Lionel
4th May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
Re-reading all the comments here it seems to me, if the next government adversely meddles with the State Pension then that party won't see power again whilst this generation of Grey Vote is still alive and voting.
MichaelS14
4th May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
I worked from the age of 17 and stayed with the same company BT for 35 years, I paid NI contributions, so deserve my pension. I also paid into my company pension scheme 6% of my wages every month and I deserve that as well. State pensions should not be means tested, it is an outrage to even contemplate it.
GlenD
4th May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
It is not a benefit, it has already been paid for by the pensioners, but it is now being portrayed by various political parties as something to be lumped in with benefit payments that have not been paid in to, (except in the taxes which we have also paid) now the younger generation seem to think we are not entitled to them.
MartinM17
4th May 2017
9
Thanks for voting!
Who the hell do these people think they are? We have paid in for state pension so we are entitled to it and that's an end to the matter. Leave pensions alone and cut foreign aid!
LynneC6
4th May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
Why hit us?
My husband and i have worked hard from early teens . We have paid our contributions we want what we are entitled too.
Where will this money be going?
There are deserving people but there are a lot who don't deserve to live off our hard work
lanthony
4th May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
Just because some people have saved money throughout their lives, it doesn't mean they have to be penalised for it which is was it would mean if pensions were mean tested. I think it would be wrong on so many levels.
If this were to happen it would just send a message to they younger generations implying, "just spend what you have now, and you will get your pension pot when you need it" .
It's a truly, wrong thing to do.
AndrewW38
4th May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
I worked all my life from 17 onwards, paid into a private pension fund with one job which was raided by the Labour chancellor at one point (fell in value by 20-30%). When I retired my State Pension was cut but I still did not make back what I lost on having a private pension! What happens to all these benefit people when they reach pension age? Will they still be getting more than someone who has worked and contributed all their lives?
WendyG6
4th May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
If it is tested then it should be against the contributions made and not given to people who have paid in nothing . There are too many who won't ( not can't) work but still receive benefits. These should earn their benefits and in return get the basic .NI stamp paid
VictoriaB9
4th May 2017
0
Thanks for voting!
Since you pay tax on your pension. I don't see what means testing is going to do other deprive someone of their respective earning, that they have earned all there working lives.
I will be lucky to see my pension due to Government cuts. I don't pay tax!
Dragonsurfer
4th May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
I am almost speechless!!! Is this idea for real???? Why would someone, anyone pay into a scheme that 'allegedly' repay you when you retire,knowing they'd get nothing....no-one!! I left school at 15 and apart from 7 years 'out' when my children were young, worked until I was 65. My husband left school at 17 and retired today, on his 65th birthday. Our state pensions are our right (in my opinion) after all we've spent the best part of 40 years 'saving' for this!!! What an absolute insult to every person who works/has worked, has/had no option but to pay into this 'rip-off scheme' and then to be means tested,.....really!!!! Our mistake along with lots of other hard working folk, was....working....because, let's be honest here.....would we really be any worse off had we never worked!!! 'They' can take their 'means test' and shove it where the sun don't shine....furiousattheverythought.com
JanG63
4th May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
If people pay into the pot, they should be able to have the right to receive their fair share. Incidentally I am not wealthy, but believe in fair play.
denpy
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
People who pay NI from their wages should be entitled to state pension. No matter whether they are high earners or lower earners they have all paid in.
yahsue
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
State pension is NOT a benefit! As a 1950's baby, I will definitely Not be voting Tory in these coming elections and the more people who care enough and do the same, the better!
DaveK2
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
It is not a state benefit; it has been earned. Therefore it should not be means tested.
HelenE7
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
People who have contributed should be treated equally.
JoanA7
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
We paid in all our working lives. For a lot of people that meant from when they were 15 yrs old until they were 65
JulianH
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
If pensions are a benefit then why do we pay taxes from it? Surely that must be illegal?
Dildiv
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
When we have all paid into the system then all should get their Pension.
JohnG35
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
No it should NOT we have paid in all our working lives and we only have a few good years of retirement before we start with age related illnesses or we die, I fear if the Conservatives are reelected in June that we are Not going to hear the end of this question.
AlanW53
3rd May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
The top 10% of earners contribute 55.3% of all the tax collected, so why should those who have paid in the most get nothing back?
Jcoz1950gmailcom
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
You have worked for it you are entitled to it.
mrscomfyman
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
People work hard and pay into the state pension scheme, so should get back what they've paid.
AnnetteC4
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Providing the required number of National Insurance Contributions have been paid then the State Pension should not be means tested.......Entitlement should only be based on contributions paid in.........
Lindylou3941
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
I have worked for over 50 years. Always paid a full stamp. So NO means testing. I paid for the state pension. It's not a Benefit.
LindaB25
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
We have all equally paid our due's - there is no question that each paying individual is not entitled to their share!!
sadcraw
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
Everyone who has been employed have paid to have the right to have retirement pension. This should not be means tested.
JoeM
3rd May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
We have paid/saved for this privilege since we started work some 40+ years ago, does not matter if you are "rich" or not. Remember, The more you earned the more you paid. It was not a standard amount, it was a percentage. So if you have some money now because of your hard work in the past, no harm in having some more, after all the more you have, the more you spend to make your life easier, which means more money in the enconomy.
PaulC2
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
This is fundamentally wrong and should be stopped at source.
People pay into the State Pension by law- already the pension age has been increased twice in an attempt to make sure people die before they get it.
Now it's suggested that people prudent enough to have made extra provision should be penalised.
The principle is all wrong.
Streetjo
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
National Insurance paid in then state pension should be paid regardless of other income. Do not penalise the wealthy just because they have managed their lives well. I do not fall into that category but we have to be fair to everyone.
ChristineA15
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
No they shouldn't.
ChristineL4
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
Whilst the wealthy may not need the pension, if they have worked and paid into the scheme they surely are entitled. I do think that the winter fuel allowance could be means tested, though, and not given to those who choose to live overseas,,,,, usually in the warmer climes.
CaroleK17
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
When people have contributed towards a payment for themselves in later life, they are entitled to receive it. Those who should not be receiving it are the idlers who spend all their BENEFITS in the bookies or the pub and have never paid any contributions into the state benefit scheme.
quilp666
3rd May 2017
9
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Of course not - it is not a benefit, it is a deferred part of ones salary paid for over a working lifetime
LynM81
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
They have contributed all these years, it's not fair to means test them! I live on Pension Credits only, so I struggle to survive, but I wouldn't be comfortable getting more because these people have been deprived of what they have already paid for! Fair is fair!
PeterR4
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
State pensions are not a benefit grant but a pension paid for from the earnings of the pensioner over their lifetime!
ChristineY1
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Wealthy or poor if you have worked all those years you have earned your pension no one should be able to take it off you if the government want to save money for resources reduce the wages of the MPs all they do is sit and fall asleep they certainly don't earn their money
laparade
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
I paid for my state pension whilst working full time and bringing up 5 children. There were no tax allowances for childcare and precious few nursery places. Also if you lived in rented accommodation there were no rent rebates/rate rebates. I paid for everything and I deserve my pension. I have not been spoon fed through childhood or adulthood.
Coopersboth
3rd May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
Why should they be means tested, people who saved for their retirement to have a better retirement are now going to be penalised, in most cases they have to pay tax, it's not right.
EllenD7
3rd May 2017
8
Thanks for voting!
Having worked my whole life and paid contributions why should I lose my pension.
However why should politicians receive a pension of much more than a hard working man or woman, if you think it should be stopped or means tested than look at the people getting huge payouts like bankers politicians etc who earn hundreds of thousands and get massive bonuses for doing nothing they don't need a state pension
ChristineJ74
3rd May 2017
9
Thanks for voting!
I have worked hard all my life and paid full contributions from my NI and never claimed anything before. State pension is not a "benefit" it is something which those of us who have been employed have already paid for !
pink rose
3rd May 2017
8
Thanks for voting!
When are these people going to get it onto their thick heads that we have paid into the state pension as a form of insurance policy it is not a benefit it is a right. Had we paid all our NI contributions onto an insurance policy we'd probably be better off.
JaniceT12
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
I agree with others who have paid all their lives - it is NOT a benefit and only recently has been called such. I too have not claimed other benefits - even as a single mother. I will also go one further. I truly believe that the Government could save money if they did not tax the State Pension. It must cost more to collect than they make!
Haigy
3rd May 2017
6
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I wonder why it is the pensioners that get hit all the time. What have we done wrong. My GRANDFATHERS. and Father worked all their lives fought for this country, never claimed any benefits what so ever. I worked all my life from being 16 never claimed for anything. I nursed my Father for 2 years until he died which must have saved the state a fortune. I had to give up my home and job to do this I got paid £45 per week and when I reached 60 his was stopped. I am not complaining as I loved my Father and wold do it all again it just makes me so angry when someone who has never worked or contributed to anything in this country can claim everything hey want but the government begrudge us a measly £150 or week and all we hear is we are living too long and becoming a burden on society. A leaf should be taken from the Scandinavian countries who look after their pensioners.
FranB4
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
State pension is not a benefit, it is paid for by the contributions of worker and their employer,
So means testing is not an option,
You pay for it, you claim it,
MadeleineC
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
I worked 50 years for my pension so am entitled to it
mick2e1hzm
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
My Wife and I have worked hard my wife did not retire until she was 69. We worked paid our tax and stamp put some aside for retirement as a lot of our generation did, and we have never claimed any benefits apart from the child allowance, what this body wants to look at is how many hours did fathers work while there kids where small 55 to 60 hrs a week was normal for me
Rocky
3rd May 2017
8
Thanks for voting!
Why should we be means tested when our generation started work at 15 and worked long hours. We have paid in for the right to a state pension
KarenO6
3rd May 2017
9
Thanks for voting!
Does not matter how much you have, if you have paid in all your life then you are entitled to ir
HilaryL1
3rd May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
If you have paid into it all your working life, then don't get it, because youave been careful with your money, where someone else has spent every penny of there's. That is not fare.
Tricia Mary
3rd May 2017
8
Thanks for voting!
I have paid into state pension since I was 15 until I retired when I was 62. I also paid into a occupational pension for 30 years so thank you very much. I will keep my pensions. Obviously not rich but the same rule must apply to all.
RichardM
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
It was paid for by contributions from age 15,--65
Browniseuk
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
People have paid into it whatever their income, so they should be entitled to it whatever, and why should you have to declare your income to claim something that is yours
contrarycat
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
I really think this is an appalling idea. We have paid for our pensions all during our working life. We could start by not using the term "pensioners benefits". It is NOT a benefit. Why on earth should we pay again when we have paid in so we could get our pensions.
Tazzbar
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
People who have plenty should not be penalised, if they worked for it they deserve it. When people who have never worked can be maintained all their life on benefits why punish those who have worked for their living.
tinatots11
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
I am a 59year old woman who has paid into the state pension since I was 15 years old. Why should I lose that? My retirement age has already been pushed up from 60 to nearly 67 as it is!
BrendaD5
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
I worked from age 15 to age 60 so I think I've earned my pension
johnboy68
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
its time that the british government started to look after the taxpayers and oaps of this country 1 bring pension age back to where it should be 2 sort out the nhs 3 stop all aid going overseas it was us that build this Britain and they are killing it
JulianS
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
I wonder if the mp s and bureaucrats will be means tested before they receive there fat pensions ,that would be fun !
DaveB94
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
Why is it that MP'S can have a salary increase of 11% which according to them it's justified but the lowly paid pensioner is being targeted for a possible means test. The Govt should be looking to enhance our pensions to a respectful amount so that living allowance is in line with household bills and food.
Dianelily
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
I was also born in 1954 so missed out on receiving my pension. I've worked since I was 16 never claimed any benefits my entire life until now. I never earned enough to save for later life but bought my 4 children up with no help from the state. I am still working although part time now and receive a very very small amount of state help. The older generation who have no savings to fall back on are treated abominably by this country. Other countries look after the elderly. This country does nothing.
JeanS5
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
Who are these people voting 'yes'? State pension is not a benefit, it is a right, paid for in full!
RuthyH
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
I think if you've worked hard all your life and paid your contributions you should be entitled to your pension. But as someone born in 1954 and all women born in the fifties who have lost our pension at 60 maybe if those people could afford not to take their pension the government could of paid us ours and not cheated us out of our pension and did so without any prior warning. Feel very let down and now a widow of 9 months find it even harder. My widow's pension finishes in July and then I have no income coming in.!!!!
JohanneC
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
If you have worked all your life and paid into your state pension, then you automatically qualify for a Pension. Those that haven't bothered to plan for their retirement have reaped what they have sown. We already supply them with an income via benefits as they don't work/contribute. You can not expect those that have worked to give up what they are entitled too, on retiring, as this then forces the workers to give up on retirement and continue to support themselves( as the state won't) and to keep paying for those that don't. Totally unfair we need to look at what we hand out for free, child benefit for children living in another country for instance, parents who insist on having large families as they get more child benefit and big houses if not working. This is what makes the UK a target for immigrant, we can no longer support these people. The UK is FULL!
bakerbob
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
We have worked all our life's for our pension and paid tax.
Slievetrue
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
The state pension was earned by contributions over my working life and is not a benefit from the government and should not be interfered with. People unable to have full contributions still entitled.
BrianF8
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
We all contribute, the wealthy somewhat more than the average through National Insurance contributions, and are therefore entitled to claim regardless of existing financial status.
ShirleyM96
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Why penalise people who have paid N.I. all their working lives for being prudent enough to make sure they have enough money coming to them when they retire. People who make no provision get every help by claiming benefits. People should be encouraged to be independent, not penalised.
Sue528
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
On the face of it I can see why pensioners feel it should not be means tested - after all they have paid their NI for years. However the minority of pensioners who are millionaires etc and therefore do not need a state pension to survive should freely give up their state pension. This saving can then be passed onto pensioners who rely on their state pension to survive and lead a decent retirement. I am a pensioner myself and feel this would be a fairer system.
Smulders
3rd May 2017
-1
Thanks for voting!
Pension entitlement should be calculated at 2% per annum over the period you contribute over 50 years contributions. Pensioners with an income of £100k or over per annum should not get state pension. Pensions should be increased and all residents continue to pay into NI until they die. Child benefit should be limited to two only. Have a look at other countries not sofar from UK. We should all payy first £100 per annum for Prescriptions, Dentist and hospital and other NHS free benefit. This would stop migrants waiting to come to UK where everything is free. It's NOT free in other EU countries! It is a very unfair situation in EU.
thefilthycripple
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
Pensions are not benefits ,we contribute to them , so your pension should be contingent on your contribution .It has taken over 40 years to dramatically reduce pensioner poverty so why bring it back ?
KatherineT
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
No if you paid in you get out it's taxed anyway
weetukiebirdie
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
It's not a benefit most people have been contributing all their adult life one way or another including the better off
ChrisL53
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
The current tax system means we who work have contributed towards that state pension no matter what our earnings. This tory government praises those who work and says work is good and rewarding. Well then reward us with the state pension we EARNED,
JanM6
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
I wonder what the definition of rich/well of would be in these circumstances, where would the line be drawn, would it be people who have managed to save just enough to be comfortable or would it be the mega rich who have money to spare? Perhaps getting people into work rather than making it more beneficial to be unemployed would make a difference so people taking low paid jobs to get into work get a subsidy rather than just handing out dole money. Limiting the numbers on child benefit as that's a personal choice now a days.
jane63c
3rd May 2017
-1
Thanks for voting!
The recommendation cites the top ten per cent only which to be seems reasonable. I would have thought anyone with resources of over £100k pa could find it in themselves to help out for the greater good.
CarolC8
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
my husband is 5years older than me all our married life we have both worked full time and we were looking forward to retiring at around the same time 65 for him and 60 for me now i have to work an extra 7 years until i can get my pension as we are self employed and also live on our business premises can someone tell me how this is going to work do we sell up on hubbies retirement and i have nothing for 7 years or does my hubbie work unti he is into his seventies stop moving the goal posts please
KennethS7
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
I find it quite frustrating that migrants who have never and some never intend to contribute get everything handed to them.The people who decide to have child after child and boast about the state keeping them ,yet pensioners who have worked and contributed irrespective how rich they finished up should be penalised to support the above .If the rich of this country wish to voluntarily not wish to take pensions or bus passes so be it but they should have a choice
angharad
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
I agree with other comments fully but would like to add a few other suggestion, isn't it time some amount was paid for prescriptions & that child benefit was reduced i.e. nothing for the first child, payment for the second and nothing for any subsequent children as they are a life style chose, this would free up money for higher pensions, as with all things those in need would have the welfare state to fall back on.
SueO8
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
Definitely Not, I have worked hard all my life, paid all my taxes and contribution. I am intilted to what the government give which is not enough to live on these day with everything going up all the time. Just give us more to live on.....
MargaretA15
3rd May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
The supposedly well off pensioners are also the ones who have to pay for their care, sometimes having to sell their homes.
Many of us carry on paying tax even when retired.
LindaD9
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
I think it's disgusting that this is even being considered. I have paid into the National Insurance for over 40 years. I can not claim my state pension until I am 66 years old. I had early retirement at 60 from my job as it was very stressful and I was working over 40 hours a week due to the pressure and work commitments. This was impacting on my health.
I have a work related pension however this puts me below the poverty line because of not receiving a state pension.
It seems as if it's take, take take by this government.
JaneA5
3rd May 2017
0
Thanks for voting!
Are we three years old? Who said life was fair? Most people only want to right an injustice which applies to them. Other people's tough deals are attributed to their lack of character. Let's try and see a bigger picture people.
Julia Slocombe
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Definitely not. Everybody has been paying in all their lives. Why should they lose out now just because they have managed to put a bit aside where others have not!!
Irene926
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
So many great comments on here. Just. A couple of suggestions/questions from me. Who says which pensioners are rich? What does rich mean actually? If the government want to recoup monies why not start with child benefit? Perhaps this benefit should be means tested and only given to truly deserving people?? After all, when people decide to have children they should be prepared to pay for their upkeep. It shouldn't go to wealthy people, in my view. If people want children they should by prepared to finance the project themselves. Why should my NI contributions go towards bringing up other people's children? Lastly, It seems to me that the more people do to provide for their retirement the more criticism they get. I dare say the majority of those who voted for means testing are the younger generation who actually resent the seniors taking their pension - most of all, including me, have paid into the system for 50 years without taking anything out, and are now only taking their 'dues'. Also, isn't it funny how we're on a benefit when it suits the system but not when it doesn't. Rant over..
MaureenB88
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
If you pay your full pension term then you are fully entitled to the money when you retire!
trahrr
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
I have paid my dues, give me a little back of what I had taken from me.
FranL
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
Why should people who have saved, been careful with their finances, be victimised again. Everybody pays for their pension whilst working, therefore what you have paid is what you get. Why should it be means tested, if you haven't paid anything into pension pot, why should you get anything.
ColinC5
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
We've all paid into the 'pot' for this, it is NOT a 'free' benefit, so I have earned this already.
Maureen.hitchins
3rd May 2017
0
Thanks for voting!
My husband and me are baby boomers. So on Margaret Thatchers advice we took out a private pension. Which made our monthly income fairly tight to live on. Than look what happened Equitable Life went bust. I wouldn't advise anyone to pay into a private pension we've advised all our three children to invest in property buy to let and they'll each have a good pension pot when the time comes.
PaulineM7
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
I paid in throughout my working life, as did most people. I topped it up to cover the years I was bringing up my children. How dare they try to treat it as a benefit!
Mags 55
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Definately NO! I've worked hard all my days & paid into the system so I'll only be getting back what I'm due. Why should people who have worked hard, saved & managed their money sensibly be penalised? To be perfectly honest the best off are the ones who have never done a days work in their lives because they are too lazy - and their are lots of them about - their are also lots of genuine people who for whatever reason aren't able to work.
chrissywnite01
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
Absolutely not, everyone regardless of wealth or lack of it who have paid their NI Contributions are entitled to it, no 'ifs, ands or buts, full stop'.
macawparrot66
3rd May 2017
9
Thanks for voting!
These so called professionals who have nothing to do except think of ways to claw back money from hard working citizens who have paid their dues during their lifetime should look to themselves. How much are they being paid for these hare brained ideas. HANDS OFF!!
LesleyA1
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
I along with many others have worked full time since the age of 16. Thanks to numerous changes to the age in which you receive the state pension I now have to work or wait another seven years. I am sure a government will attempt to move this further back! I have not claimed any benefits in my life the state pension is not a benefit. I object to loosing seven years of my state pension when others in this country choose to live off the state often with more disposable income than those who work full time
Amelia1947
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
If you save for your retirement you are a fool. If you don't save and spend spend you get more credits you go in a home with out paying, don't have to sell your home to pay for it. Get free dentist treatment and lots of other things . So No if you have paid in your Full stamps you should get your full pension
Dellboy56
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
I am fast approaching pension age and frankly the spectre of it scares the heck out of me to the point I don't think i'll ever be in a position to retire! People can say you should have saved, you should have taken out a pension or insurance, but quite frankly I bet a large proportion of people were to busy budgeting for homes, childrens needs etc to afford these on their wages. Yes, means test those who can afford it, yes they've paid in the same as the rest of us I agree but who says that should even those people fall short on retirement funds then be able to reapply if the need arises. Also, so long as any pension money was redistributed to pensioners not other places. Surely, we've earned the right to live in dignity in later years and not simply work till we drop?
Lesley M
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
If you have worked all your life and paid all your stamps, regardless of how much you are worth you are entitled to your state pension, end of story.
Oldkeefy
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
I would insist that my previous decades of NI payments were reimbursed back to me - with interest!!!
Kobyhodge
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
I contributed for almost 50 yrs, The State Pension is not a gift from the Government but an often partial repayment of the contributions made. I am sure there are some wealthy people who would volunteer to donate a part of their pension, but it should not be mandatory. I live on my basic State Pension but can only do so by choosing to live in Poland, it was not enough to sustain life for my Polish wife and I in the UK living in modest rented accommodation. The basic State Pension is insufficient and should be increased to reflect the real cost of living for us older people.
LindaC42
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
They are looking to deny people who have paid into the system over many many years, so Ehy are they giving MPs pension rights after just 4 years service?? That is wrong, stop that and save thousands. Servicemen and women have to serve 20 years to get a pension. My husband was in the RN for twelve years was was entitled to zero benefits!!!
RetiredRGN
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
So how many Tories are she n this 'top economic body' or is this just a pseudonym for the Government ! This is NOT a benefit! what they should consider is abolishing the Governments pensions altogether see how they like that!
Champagne Chick
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
The problem with means testing is the criteria might change with different governments. Having worked and paid my contributions all of my life without any cushion whatsoever when times were tough, having to wait six years longer than previously thought I do want my pension without the possibility of it being reduced.
Prosseco
3rd May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
If you have worked all your life regardless of how much you are worth you should be allowed to have your state pension.
DawnS5
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
Every person that gets a state pension has payed for it in there national insurance so it belongs to them not the government
Cuddlybear50
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
Absolutely not! I have paid all my working life why should the Government keep my money.
RichyRich
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Exactly agree with what most people have said, regardless of whether people are so called rich or not they have paid in all their working lives and are entitled to their pensions, what about all these freeloaders who contribute nothing and get all the entitlements.
ChristinaB9
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
I have paid into a state pension all my life and have a tiny private pension, but at 70 years old I still have to work to supplement my current income. I have a mortgage to pay until I am 82, don't ask how I managed that, and will have to sell to release some money. I am very fortunate, but by no means wealthy, I think all pensioners should get at least £150 per week which is not the case for me because of being too old. Do not means test.
saladmuncher
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
First of all we all pay NI, regardless of income whether it be large or small, towards eligibility for the '35 years' subscription to receive a state pension. Therefore it seems wrong to me to expect 'wealthy' pensioners to forgo their rights. If you have satisfied the legal requirement to receive a pension, then you should get it. Many of us have the view that receiving a pension is a right as we have paid in our dues, but interestingly these days more and more it is described by politicians as a 'benefit', as if we are receiving something for nothing.
Also, who decides what wealthy means? Someone who is just starting out with nothing at the age of 20, who pays NI through PAYE for years might work very hard and become a high earner, only being classed as 'wealthy' as he heads towards pension age. Finally, I think the amount of money saved would not be sufficient to cover the costs of means testing every pensioner.
ChristinaB9
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
You have hit the nail right on the head. Thank you this is something I would definitely campaign against.
RichardW5
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
We have paid in all our working lives so the pension is something we deserve it should not be changed.
Dgill
3rd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Shocking.. what do they define as rich? I have paid in to this all my working life as well as general taxation at higher rates to make provision to meet my needs in old age without being a burden on the state and now they want to takd away a key part of my retiral financial planning at the last minute
MaryA2
3rd May 2017
-1
Thanks for voting!
Being that the disabled are not even given the chance to have a say about there benefits then the wealthy should not be given the chance to have their say. Just take it off them .they probably wouldn't even miss it.
SheilaB83
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
I have worked and tried to save when I could. I had time off to look after my children (exactly the amount of time you are allowed, which should not affect your pension). When I checked what my pension was I found out I was a long way short of standard pension. Apparently, The reason why, was because I had my children to early (1967) A friend who only actually worked for about 15 years, the rest of the time on benefits, gets a full pension. I also know people who have blown all their earnings and now have a pension topped up with benefits. Why the hell should people who work hard and and make provision for their old age be penalised again.
AnnetteT
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
We have saved and paid into a private pension too why should we be means tested. I f we need care we will have to pay for it ourselves. Enough is enough. We are by no means wealthy
JanA7
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
We have worked many years to receive our pension which incidentally isn't a benefit. Luckily we paid into a private pension which is allowing us to enjoy retirement. I am fed up hearing that pensioners are better off than working people.
royalblue1
3rd May 2017
4
Thanks for voting!
Absolutely no way should this happen. People have paid in all their lives for this and are entitled to it. Just because they were able to have a private pension should not even come into the reckoning!!!
Joyce34
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
If you have paid in then you are entitled to it regardless what money you have on e they start means testing then bring in all sorts of rules to make people none eligible for it we get little enough now.
LynneB21
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
If you put in to the system you should get a pension too many people these days haven't even contributed anything and still get a pension May be a better way iwould be if you don't put in you don't get
Felsberg
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
Many of us, like myself, have never had anything from the state. Therefore, as this is something I have paid into having worked all my working life I see no reason why I should not receive it. Because of this I do not think it should be means tested.
Lu
3rd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
So if you've worked hard all your life, paid into the Pension and managed to maybe save a little for your retirement, you could get penalised. Had I known, we could have satayed at home on benefits watching TV and smoking, etc. The people that did will actually be better off. They mostly have their rent paid for them as well. Those of us who struggled to buy our homes are faced with maintenance costs, etc. We tell our grandchildren to work hard, makes me wonder if it's worth it!
royalblue1
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
RosemaryH1
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
It should not be means tested we pay into it all our,working lives and it is NOT a benefit it's our,entitlement.
Brisue
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
It's similar to investing money in the bank and then not being allowed to take it back out.
YvonneJ2
3rd May 2017
1
Thanks for voting!
I've worked 43years full time mostly in low income wages ,I have paid my stamp and taxes ,I'm a woman born in the 50s and no warning of changes and now have to work till 66 /67 .I have paid up for full pension now but still have to work and still pay my stamp if I make it to then I'll live a very modest lifestyle but I personally would like my pension now or sooner because I've earned it but after looking after my mother who ended up in a home and sadly gave up the fight if that's in store for me then push me over a cliff .There are people living in this green and giving land (to all others in foreign aid )yet still dying because they can't keep warm ,Bewildered and sadly getting more angry as I get older but do a day in a hospice every now and again that sorts me out .
EsmeB
3rd May 2017
9
Thanks for voting!
while I was growing up there were lots of people out there who were capable of working but preferred to claim benefits, those same people are being paid without ever contributing and unlike myself and millions of others will get any homecare needed in the future paid as well. The millions that have paid all their working life and worked hard to provide a roof over their families head are penalised. They say we are the lucky generation but I remember struggling to pay a mortgage with 15% interest, we couldn't afford to be stay at home mums. We are entitled to our state pension.
gasue
3rd May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
Maybe richer pensioners could be asked if they would like to volunteer not to receive their pension, but if they have paid NI contributions they are entitled to receive their pension. How do you define rich anyway. I am a pensioner and I manage ok with no debts and I am able to enjoy my retirement with holidays etc, but I do not regard myself as rich. Perhaps it should be those in the higher tax bracket but they probably have higher outgoings than I do with large properties so higher bills to pay. As for any money saved from such a scheme, it should go first and foremost to poorer pensioners with a view to helping younger people in need if there is any cash left to do that. The basic pension is £120 ish a week for some but it has now been increased to £150 ish each week. Those already on £120 remain at that level, which in my view is outrageous! All pensioners should receive this increased rate. If we perhaps capped the pension rate for all at a reasonable level, there would be money over to help younger members of the community.
[deleted]
2nd May 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
Lionel
2nd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Yes, Scandiman, it would be quite profitable for the State and any other pension provider you have, for your demise to be earlier rather than later. That, I think, would be an actuary's dream.

Since 1984, I think, when Thatcher meddled with superannuation and told us all to get ourselves a private pension, the entire matter of annuities quickly became a quagmire, with we expectant recipients at the bottom of that pit and no hope of ever seeing daylight. In the last thirty years we have all been fed lies by providers, robbed of so much money under the most spurious of arrangements that our work place pensions are worth so much less than was promised. This next might resonate with you.

I have a pal in this hamlet. He was a local Bobby for years. Nice chap. He retired after thirty years - actually he was removed - and given a desk job in civvies. With 24 hours notice he was removed again, to be replaced by computer software.

He had bought into two private pensions and was expecting, I understand, 35% of final salary on retirement. He got 21% on leaving and his private pensions delivered a little less than half projected amount. The job he wanted, as a ranger on the Norfolk Broads, wasn't possible. Too poorly paid to sustain a wife and two teenage sons even with his pensions. He's a fit, athletic fifty five years old reduced to being a security chap in Morrisons. His State pension chimes in when he's sixty seven and some months. My pal is battered and bruised from years in the Police. He deserves his professional retirement.

He said last Autumn, I'm damned if I'll die early to please these bar stewards. I'll keep myself fit and healthy and they'll have to pay me 'till the day I die.

This is one angry ex-copper. There will be many more.
nuttie48
2nd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Government already know the richest pensioners because of the amount of taxes they pay so they do not need to means test them.
Lionel
2nd May 2017
3
Thanks for voting!
Yes, far too much government intervention and spying.
linda1959
1st May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
If you have paid into the pot then you deserve to get back what is due like everyone else
Gregg1100g
1st May 2017
7
Thanks for voting!
Most of us have paid into the system all our working lives, so expect to get out pensions. Our right, not as some say an entitlement.
A lot of "wealthy "pensioners may have been left property or money. Certainly doesn't apply to us.
VSOP
1st May 2017
5
Thanks for voting!
Can anyone explain to me, at what point regarding a persons assets/income/savings etc. does one become .... rich, or ("just comfortable") and should therefore be penalised by having their state pension reduced or withdrawn?
And more, does anyone know of a politician or civil servant mandarin who has the skills or management savvy and common sense to make a sane and fair judgment on this issue?
Yodama
1st May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
And what happens when a rich ( whatever rich means ) person suffers an economic tsunami and loses everything, then he/she will have to undergo the undignified procedure of being means tested?

Maybe join the ranks of benefit recipients and re-classified as one on the other side of the great divide.
How will that affect the pension?
Lionel
1st May 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
VSOP, I like the name, Very Superior Old Pale, as applied to a good cognac.

Your comment is well informed and very pertinent. The Civil Service deals in thresholds, arbitary numbers quite unrelated to reality, although I'm sure some statistical evidence would undergird their decisions. But statistics ...

But I echo your question, who is to determine the recipients of the State Pension? If it were left to our MP, a multi millionaire land owning farmer and we were denied the contracted payment ... maybe he would be found floating in a slurry tank!

I feel this government hasn't yet grasped the power of the Grey Vote. As it is, there's but a few weeks for them to understand.
Lionel
30th Apr 2017
6
Thanks for voting!
I for one, can't see this as a money saving enterprise, no, but rather one of extending state bureacracy, as Scandiman so rightly says.

We Boomers have been around since the early to mid post War years. Therefore, successive governments have known the baby bulge was going to hit first, education, then the work place; the NHS would be severely affected by this swelling of numbers and finally pensions and elder care. But each government has declined to address any part of the baby bulge effect, preferring to bury their heads in the sand and leave it to the next administration. And so it went on until ...

Oh dear, the early Boomers required the State to honour their pledge to provide a State pension as a right of having paid NI all our working lives. Not that we had a choice, no, the money was removed at source. I don't recall any qualification on receiving a State pension, whether we made it big or not, the pension was ours by right of having paid for it during our working years.

During the late Forties and early Fifties the baby boom peaked. But we provided labour and entrepreneurial skills which took the nation to unprecedented heights of wealth and opulence. Yet still the State didn't address the issue, what provision have we for their pensions? Neither did successive governments provide for later life care for us, care which we were told we were paying for.

To now even suggest our pensions should be means tested is an insult piled upon insults to our generation. Add to this the fact that Gordon Brown instituted a private pensions raid of £5 billion a year little more than a decade after Thatcher told us to take out these pensions ... and the fact that the sixth richest nation on this planet offers the lowest pensions in Europe - Spain is £25,000 a year and Germany £15,000 a year whilst our best state pension is around £7,500 a year.

Does such means testing justify our honest endeavours in working hard, buying property, making money and providing for ourselves. Is the State absolved from it's responsibilities because we worked hard all our lives? Perhaps we should invite our resident businessman (now retired) Rooftop Crow to comment. After so many exchanges with him I'm sure he'll have something to say.

And just bye the bye, does anyone else feel the front of their kilt is getting a little wet?
Thisissixtyblog
30th Apr 2017
5
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The state pension is not a benefit and therefore should not be means tested. If it was, then how would we encourage anyone to pay into a private scheme as well. There would be no point if by doing so, one simply reduced the amount of state pension they got.
jamesjoyce01
30th Apr 2017
8
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If you have paid your money into the system then surely regardless of how rich or poor you are you are entitled to the same as everybody else that's called democracy
Billythequiche
30th Apr 2017
4
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I get a little peeved repeating this, sorry, no offence intended. The state pension is NOT a benefit, it is a contract with the government that by having N.I. stopped automatically from your earnings you will receive a pension for life. Bus passes, fuel allowance etc. are benefits and up for discussion. I would be loath to lose them but can see the fairness of means testing. Any pension paid for out of earnings should not be counted, but pensions gifted as part of deals should.
Lionel
30th Apr 2017
3
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You are so right. The Pension is not a benefit and it is a state contracted payment when we reach a certain age. No ifs, no buts ... hang on, didn't one of our politicians say those words?
Billythequiche
1st May 2017
1
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Can't remember who said that, Bevan? As I get older I get more cynical about the sincerity of politicians of all persuasions. Though definitely not left wing, I am mostly apolitical. The proposals to protect work pensions should be enshrined in law at the earliest moment. It should not be difficult, monies should be ''ring fenced'' and schemes fully funded at all times. No company should be allowed to be sold without these measures in place and as a scheme that takes in money from members is in affect a contract, the CEO and shareholders should be personally liable for deficits.
Wilf
1st May 2017
0
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I totally agree with you we have seen far too much of workers pensions being subject to fraud and carelessness. The government needs to step in and get its teeth into this. A lifetime of work and people like those in the mirror with maxwell or BHS get years of worry with this scenario
Wilf
30th Apr 2017
2
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Technically I suppose the state should not be making payouts to people who are rich however those people have paid more in tax and so one could argue they are defiantly entitled to the state pension . Also they got taxed more heavily anyway so have paid in more to society. If the state does not want to pay them a pension it should raise their taxes more.
Yodama
30th Apr 2017
3
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The divide between the 'haves and have nots ' has been widening year after year, a means tested pension entitlement will widen that divide even further.
Means testing only serves to rob people of their dignity and stigmatises them. ( William Beveridge report.)

If the rich want to voluntarily give up their pensions, winter fuel allowance, bus passes, free TV license etc; it is up to them to volunteer.
By dint of contributions and age , they are entitled to their pensions.
Are we already in a plutocratic age or at least heading for one?
Wilf
30th Apr 2017
1
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I agree Yodama and also can you image the cost of the bureaucracy to stop the rich from getting their pensions. It would probably cost hundreds of millions!
[deleted]
30th Apr 2017
5
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Wilf
30th Apr 2017
2
Thanks for voting!
There was a report a couple of weeks ago saying we spend aid on Nigeria, Pakistan and India. All quite wealthy countries and India has a space programme. While I agree with foreign aid surely it should go to peoples in really poor countries like Sudan, Central African republic etc and it should be carefully placed. In the same article in the Times it said UK consultants were making a fortune out of milking the aid system. How can that be right???
Billythequiche
2nd May 2017
0
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As usual you scored a bulls-eye, the evil is not in the aid itself but in the incompetence of the administrators in allowing shady, or even corrupt, middlemen to milk aid for a profit. We look down our noses at corruption abroad, we should be able to hold to account the people who allow it to happen here. Time and again managers/administrators in public service and ''mega industries'' like banking get away with gross incompetence/negligence that would have got us mere mortals sacked or prosecuted; some even profit by it.
Wilf
2nd May 2017
0
Thanks for voting!
Totally agreed. there is too much aid paid out but its because I think only about 20% gets to the end user. the rest is wasted by bureaucracy and mismanagement and by management parasites skimming off their fat from it. The issue is the ones who are the gatekeepers...ie the Uk government employees are usually bureaucratic and inept themselves. makes you want to weep for the people who are ill, destitute and need the help.

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