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Is a bad deal better than remaining in the European Union?

Jacob Rees-Mogg warns Brexit could be lost if MPs vote down May’s deal again.

The leader of the Tory European Research Group says a long delay to Brexit could mean the UK never leaves the EU.

Leading Tory Brexiteer Jacob Rees-Mogg has warned that Britain may never leave the European Union if Theresa May’s deal is voted down by MPs for a third time.

Mr Rees-Mogg, chairman of the influential Conservative European Research Group (ERG), said he still regarded the Prime Minister’s Withdrawal Agreement as a “very bad deal”.

However, he expressed concern that if there was now a long delay to the UK’s departure from the EU – due to take place on March 29 – Brexit could be thwarted altogether.

“No deal is better than a bad deal but a bad deal is better than remaining in the European Union,” he said during an LBC radio phone-in.

It is thought the Prime Minister could delay the crucial vote for another week unless she is confident of avoiding a third humiliating defeat on the package, which MPs rejected by 230 votes in January and 149 last week.

She has warned that if her deal is not approved, the UK will have to seek a lengthy extension to negotiations, potentially losing Brexit altogether.

What are your views?

Is a bad deal better than remaining in the European Union?

4622 people have already voted, what's your opinion? Yes No

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MikeB76
8th Jul 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Let’s get out and stop giving money to all others instead of our own people time we looked after British people
pip2
26th May 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
So what is the customs union anyway?

It's like the skin of a body. It's a group of countries that charge the same for imports from the rest of the world but not each other.

It means orange juice from Egypt is charged the same whether it comes in at Trieste in Italy, or Rotterdam in Netherlands, or Folkestone in Kent.

Turkey is in the customs union too. But it's not in EU or single market so there are long queues of lorries in Turkey to enter EU members Bulgaria and Greece.

Norway is not in the customs union or EU but it is in the single market. There are customs posts between Norway and EU neighbour Sweden.

Customs is about keeping dangerous things out as well. When one country sees things like unsafe childrens' toys that don't meet CE standards, all the countries know. This is called the EU Rapid Alert system. Known as RAPEX.

To keep track of the total amount of orange juice imported? That's the job of the European Commission.
Speeednet
24th May 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Somebody wanted some facts,how about these?

https://youtu.be/FnSok2etfDg
pip2
12th May 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
EU is a democracy, not a dictatorship.

There's not a ban on polar bear skins because Denmark said no.

Because Denmark is related to Greenland where Inuit rely partly on hunting polar bears to make a living.

Sorry if you don't like that but there it is.

EU is a group of democratic countries, not a utopia.
pip2
11th May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
We send £800 million a week to banks and private companies. Let's spend it on the NHS instead.

That's how much the UK central government debt interest costs. About 4.9% of total government spending.

Source: Office for Budget Responsibility, estimate for 2019-20.

£41.6 billion a year is 800 million a week.

EU budget is only about 1.1% of UK government spending.

It runs a court so disputes in Europe can be settled peacefully.

It makes British services and goods legal in all the other member countries. It pays for good things and some of that comes home.

It's a bargain.
pip2
11th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
EU is encouraging more energy efficient kettles, not stopping Brits drinking tea.

EU is helping British steel industry with anti-dumping rules against Chinese steel wires below market prices, not harming British steel.

EU is trying to help polar bears with climate action policy, not harm polar bears.

The European Commission proposed a ban on polar bear skins. But it did not go through. Why? Because Denmark said no. It was Denmark that said no, not the European Commission.

Turkey is not joining the EU anytime soon, if ever. And every EU member has to say yes.

Immigration can be a good thing. Underfunding the NHS is caused by the government in Downing Street, not the EU.
Pendle Witch
11th May 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
The country voted to leave, not to make deals.

Teresa May said she would leave without a deal but seems to have been thwarted and can do nothing because the M.P.'s are doing their own thing instead of what the majority asked them to do.

What is the point in voting?
pip2
11th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Three points for you.

1) For anything to be taken across borders legally it has to be legal on both sides.

2) After the disenfranchisement.
The misinformation.
The abandoned promises.
The discredited claims.
The immoral advert demonising refugees.
The scandals.
The lawbreaking.
The dark money ads on Facebook.

Do we get a chance to look again? What's your answer to citizens' rights, Northern Ireland, EU programmes?

3) What's wrong with the fantastic project of peace and cooperation?

So there you were, on 23 June 2016. In the polling booth... What was on your mind? It would be nice to know.
pip2
11th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Oh and please remember there are four parts to this country - England, Scotland, Wales and NI.

The UK has two land borders with fellow EU countries. Ireland, and Spain because of Gibraltar.

The customs union that means it doesn't matter if orange juice from Egypt comes in to EU countries through Trieste in Italy or Rotterdam in Netherlands or Felixstowe?

The single market that makes British banks licenced to do work for other banks in Frankfurt and Paris and Amsterdam and so on?
longtime john
9th May 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Well who can tell, if no deal comes about we will just have to get on with it , as the politicians should be doing.
My view of us leaving the EU , is because we have to put up with directives from Brussels and there isn't much we can do about it , just as our trying to leave is being frustrated by the same people and again we can't do much about it . Rightly or wrongly the UK voted to leave , get on with it.
pip2
11th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Directives are made with British ministers and British MEPs at the table and taking part.

Directives are good things.

What's wrong with the electronic devices emissions directive?

Helps make sure your laptop computer doesn't interfere with radios. For example.
pip2
11th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
And directives are put forward by the European Commission that has got British staff.

Sir Julian King. Head of European Commission staff from UK. His job: Security Union.

And Permanent Representatives. Professional diplomats from each country.
Hyacynth
4th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Churchill backed us to 'stand alone' because we had no choice but he didn't recommend it.

This is not a time to be going it alone. America and Russia are delighted to see us fragmenting. A united Europe is a real threat to their supremacy and Brexit is playing into their hands. We will be merely picked off and consumed by one or the other. We will probably wind up as some dodgy tax haven playing it every which way we can to keep in with our 'betters'. Like I've said the Leave rhetoric is all just that - words, no plan. God help us !

Phil Jones you are a well informed and brave man ! I've enjoyed reading you! Meanwhile, I think that all that can be said to those determined to chuck us all off a cliff has been said.......Like you I will continue to argue for sanity and peace, haha but I suspect that my work is done here 🙂
Speeednet
5th May 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Just as a matter of interest, we are not leaving Europe, we are leaving the corrupt cartel called the EU. Europeans can still be our allies, the difference is that we will get to pick and choose what battles we fight.

The EU army has nothing to do with the defence of Europe against foreign aggressors, we have nothing to fear but fear itself. The EU has not kept the peace since the last war, NATO did that. The EU army is a mechanism of upmarket mercenaries that will be sent across borders to control the hoi polloi when they rise up against the undemocratic leaders of the EU. This can already be seen in action now in France and recently in Barcelona.
pip2
5th May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Thank you Hyacynth.

Did you like Heseltine's speech at the last London march?

Churchill? Being without allies? "That was his fear".
pip2
5th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
EU accounts have always been audited. Please see European Court of Auditors report. Available online to 1977.

Everything decided is done according to a rule of law. Please see the 2017 annual report of the Court of Justice of the EU.

EU takes steps against monopolies. Competition rules. Please see "The European Union explained - Competition" from EU Publications Office.

There are some things where your first response for security "has not been and should not be military". Please see Vidar Helgesen's 2015 article for Open Democracy.

Did you know gold from North Korea's banks is banned in EU?

Did you know gunmen who have helped hold illegal Ukraine elections are banned from holding bank accounts or property in EU countries?

Please see sanctionsmap.eu.
ARG
24th May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
"Corrupt cartel"? Our government is a haven of probity, I suppose?

As for an EU army, all that has been suggested so far, as I understand it, is a type of rapid reaction force, thought necessary in the face of possible threat from Russia. This will only formalise what goes on today, with troops from many countries stationed in the Baltics and the arctic. Britain would have a veto on such a development, or might just choose not to be a party.

I don't think foreign troops or police have been active in either France or Barcelona, as France and Spain are both sovereign (note the word!) countries.
Hyacynth
4th May 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
"I am not interested in any of the arguments about the whys and wherefores of alleged benefits or lack thereof of EU membership."

What are you interested in then?
Is that how you would launch off on a summer holiday?
Without bothering to:
pack
book a ticket.,
check out how far you will travel,
check the total cost?
How does that happen?
Hyacynth
4th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
2% is not a democratic majority in a matter so important. The usual safeguards against drastic action from a public referendum were not put in place. This is on Cameron's head. He didn't bother because he was so sure that the result would be remain.

This was not a football match or a horse race. 'Winning by a nose' is not the issue. It is a technicality which is tearing the country apart.

Nothing was in place to deal with this because the powers that be were not ready for this result.

The result has been the violent destruction of our tenuous democracy which should have been addressed under more peaceful circumstances.

The power vacuum and chaos which has resulted is terrifying.

How anyone can celebrate this as a triumph of democracy beats the hell out of me. It is a disaster beyond all imaginings. I would be happy to cotemplate leaving the EU in the presence of one single coherent plan.

..and the presence of the 280 alternative trade agreements which need to be in place to make this possible. 6 weeks ago we had 5 !!! I've heard nothing since.

Ah yes and Mr Reece Mogg...well he would say that wouldn't he?. A Hard Brexit would have made billions for him. His very own Merchant Bank specialises in expedited supplies and works with the far East.
Check out "Somerset Capital Management".

As to cries of democracy

"(public referendums ) are by tradition extremely rare due to the principle of parliamentary sovereignty meaning that they cannot be constitutionally binding on either the Government or Parliament, although they usually have a persuasive political effect."

This one should not be binding, most particularly if it continues to rip up our country and to divide friend from friend.

A sudden Brexit like this has surely proved itself to be a rotten idea. I don't blame thos who voted leave , I do balme the power mongers who lied about the consequences of a Brexit referndum result.
pip2
5th May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Good answer thank you H.
Speeednet
13th May 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
52 - 48 is 4 not 2, it's 4 and the 4% accounted for more than one and a half million people.

Just saying.
pip2
13th May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Since then the population itself has changed.

So have the arguments.

Do you think I enjoyed voting with David Cameron?

I say stay in the EU, why? Because I am happy with the way everything is now? Absolutely not!

There are loads of things wrong. But most of them are things that are wrong with our own country that are in our own hands.

The cruelty and incompetence of the Home Office for a start.

The carelessness of the running of the NHS. Where people from non-EU countries who have come to work in the NHS get charged every year in case they need medical help themselves. The mean-spiritedness beggars belief.
pip2
2nd May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
The answer to the question by Silversurfers is,

The best deal with EU, is membership of EU.

For this country. And our neighbours.
Yodama
3rd May 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
pip2
3rd May 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
That's not what people from all the other EU countries are saying.

People who came in good faith. Done nothing wrong.

Made to feel unwelcome. Unwanted. Couldn't stop crying. Betrayed. Upset. Angry. Sad. Dissappointed. Anxious.

Insulted by politicians. Called "citizens of nowhere". "Queue jumpers".

Now made to apply for permission to stay in their own home. Your future in the hands of the Home Office.

And all of this, after having had no say at all.

Same for British in Europe. At Brussels rally, I met a couple who had come from Spain. Their lives turned upside down.

Same for people from Ireland and NI. I went to the Irish Border Communities protest. "Let down. Ignored. Sometimes angry".

I went to European Citizens Meeting in Kassel, Germany. Met people who said they are concerned that the young people, have they been taught enough about the past and why the EU exists?

It's time to support our neighbours and be a welcoming country.
pip2
2nd May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
So what you're saying is you are not able to engage with the arguments.

It means you are admitting that you have no argument.

You seem to be saying that literally the only reason for wanting something that you cannot say what it is... is because that's what you said nearly three years ago and you did not have an argument then either.

Is that really what you are saying? If so it has no credibility at all?
Hyacynth
4th May 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
You were told that the referendum would be abided by because Cameron was currying favour with UKIP, using their votes to stay in power. He never imagined a leave majority would happen.

You speak of facts. I have not heard a single fact from a single person who wishes to leave. I'd love to !

Other than the fact that many people don't want immigrants working in the country.

This won't change. We desperately need the labour force.
After Brexit they will be drawn from Africa, the Indian continent and the Far East instead of Europe that's all.

I'm fine with that but I will sorely miss my own freedom of movement through Europe. I love Europe with everything it has to offer. But I would also love travel in the Far East and Africa. so maybe the new trade deals which we will need there will open new doors for me and I, in turn, can look forward to opening the doors to welcome new neighbours and more diversity. Every cloud.
pip2
5th May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
On the contrary, May's proposal is extreme. While also leaving key questions unanswered...
pip2
11th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Scandiman admits he has no argument.
pip2
2nd May 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Do you want to stay in the EU?

Everyone can agree what that means.

There is a body of law with 60 years experience behind it.

There are legal documents signed by national leaders.

Going back to the founding of the Council of Europe in 1949.

Or, do you want 'something else'?

Being in is better because it gives certainty for:

- 3 million citizens of other EU countries in the UK

- 1.2 million British in Europe

- The peace in Northern Ireland and the border region

- The EU funds and programmes like the agricultural guarantee fund and the Horizon 2020 science fund and the EU social fund and the European Investment Bank and help for nuclear decommissioning in Bulgaria...

- Businesses and researchers and copyright holders and universities and farmers and fishermen and airlines and people in Gibraltar...

This should be a welcoming country that keeps its promises and earns the trust and respect of the world.
pip2
1st May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
The European Court of Auditors reports have not always been favourable. Far from it.

The 1977-78 report said there were errors that took too long to be put right.

Where does money go?

One third for farming.

One third regional development.

About 7% admin.

The EU budget is small at under 1.25% of Europe's gross national income.

I'll be at Pulse of Europe in High Wycombe this Sunday, 2 pm, Church St. Come and say hello. 🙂
Speeednet
30th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Not a message for the readers here, but a message for their children and grand children.

https://twitter.com/SocialM85897394/status/1123165118567714816
pip2
1st May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Says purveyor of fake news? No, thank you.

My name is Phil Jones and I am ready to stand by what I say.
pip2
30th Apr 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Perhaps I have not explained well enough.

The EU has 7 institutions. 7 supporting bodies. 45 agencies.

One of the institutions is the Court of Auditors. Set up in 1977.

The job of the Court of Auditors is to audit all the other institutions, supporting bodies and agencies. All the EU funds and programmes.

The Court has to be independent. Yes it is a part of the EU but it's separate to all the other parts of the EU.

Sometimes the Court find things wrong. For instance, in the Galileo satellite programme the European Commission handed in accounts late.

The Court's report on the Natura 2000 wildlife programme says it could be better.

Who audits the accounts of the European Court of Auditors itself? There has been a question in the European Parliament about that. It's done by another outside auditor. I haven't seen that report and don't know where to read it so that is a good question.
pip2
1st May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
I'd rather you used my name. Phil Jones.
Speeednet
1st May 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Speeednet
1st May 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
OK Mr Jones, it won't make the painful facts any less palatable for you however.
pip2
2nd May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
I don't have anything to do with that website.

Reputable sources please.
ARG
24th May 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Breitbart!! God's teeth! How's Mr. Bannon?
pip2
28th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Together we are greater than the sum of our parts.

EU membership is good for people from other EU countries in the UK.

Good for British in Europe.

Good for the peace in Ireland.

Good because of all the EU funds and programmes.

Good for our neighbours and good for us.

Say Yes to Europe.

Vote on May 23rd.

Whoever you choose, choose Europe.
Speeednet
29th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Well I have to say pip that you are certainly earning your thirty pieces of silver with all this drum beating for the EU. The commissariat will be pleased with your effort.
pip2
30th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
My name is Phil Jones, not pip.

What's your name?

I earn exactly £0 from doing this. If anything it is costing me.
Speeednet
30th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
If you lot have your way, it will cost us all. For ever.
pip2
2nd May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Well that's interesting.

What do you mean by cost?

I am glad to be a citizen of a country that is a net contributor to the EU budget.

It shows this country supports values like human dignity, non-discrimination, human rights, pluralism and the rule of law.

Worth it for that reason alone.
pip2
28th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
EU accounts have always been audited.

'Signed off' every year since 2007.

European court of auditors reports? All online.

Everything is the job of national government.

Except where it makes sense to work together.

Example? Worried about the Asian hornet?

The European Alien Species Information Network is run by EU.

It's legal framework is all online.

Made possible by the treaties. Proposed by the Commission. Approved by national governments. And by elected citizens in the European Parliament.
powell808
27th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
There are many positives of being part of Europe but when freedom of movement means freedom to drain our country of its resources, such that our NHS, social housing, spending for infrastructure, etc, is being depleted beyond reasonableness, then it is time to do something about it. If people work here then they should put money back into our country. Allowing people to work here then send money back to there family, who incidentally are receiving benefits from this country, is totally unacceptable. I totally support immigration, it is needed, but there has to be better controls over the benefits systems. For me, if we could remove freedom of movement, then I would have voted to remain. I wouldn't expect to go live in Spain, take from their benefit systems and then send the money back to the UK, and I don't believe other parts of Europe would stand for such practice.
pip2
28th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Freedom of movement is not a free-for-all.

In other EU countries you have to report your presence within a reasonable time.

You have to register if you are staying more than 3 months.

You have to be able to support yourself. You may need health insurance.

Details on Your Europe - residence rights. On europa.eu.

Free movement is about equality of opportunity. A level playing field. It is all reasonable.

Non discrimination benefits businesses as well as people.

For instance it means UK based airlines can fly anywhere in Europe and not be discriminated against in favour of national airlines.

Free movement is a wonderful achievement. Let's look after it. Stay in the EU. 🙂
Mrchipps1
26th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I believe that the sooner ,we leave Europe either with or without a deal, the sooner this country and the people can settle down and get on with their lives, many of them have been affected by the uncertainty that has been brought about , the irresponsible actions of everyone concerned from the PM ,members of parliament and others who needlessly interfered to stop Brexit simply for this own selfish ends and against the majority of people who voted for Brexit

we have lives before we joined the EU and with guts and determination, we can again grow and have country and nation of caring people that we can again be proud of and which will be admired by countries around the world??
RabHaw
23rd Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
We have seen listed a number of points that the Brexiteers believe is reasoning for leaving Europe . It fails to realise the following positive and significant benefits that we enjoy .
1. Freedom to work live or retire anywhere in a European Union country
2. Holidays in Europe easier and safer including European Health Care
3. Sustains millions of jobs
4. Our businesses depend on it
5. Economic influence
latin
26th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Absolutely no gain from the corrupt Europrats!
Show me any country that is happy under a centralisation?
Who wants federalism and on top of that pay for the privilege!
We can think for ourselves we can remain free and spend our own money on rebuilding our own infrastructures!
If the EU Federalists declare they are democratic tell me what club you know that you pay vast sums of your cash on its latest whims won’t allow you to leave!
Wonder why?
Our hard earnt tax is the reason they want us locked in nothing more !
Because without our cash they will really struggle with the continued building of their Federalist state!
Books not audited ?
Where is our money going while these corrupt Federalists swill the best wines eat the best goods and live lives in unbelievable luxery at our expense!
Remember what Gorbachev said, ‘what are we playing st wanting to build a Federalist state while Russians want our democracy!
pip2
28th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Nonsense.

The European Commission is CUTTING the number of things it does.

It's called the subsidiary review.

EU is only about the things that can ONLY be best done together.
pip2
28th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Thank you Rab..

Have you seen all the booklets from EU Publications Office?

Free PDFs to download online.

About how EU works. Its history.

Its work. Environment. Media and culture. Competition. Food safety. Farms. Fishing. Single market. Migration and asylum. Fundamental rights...

Have you heard of the Balance of Competences Review. Done by UK gov. in 2012-14. tinyurl.com/balcomp
pip2
29th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Do you know of misconduct by an EU body?

That's an extremely serious allegation.

It has to be taken immensely seriously.

Because the EU is based on trust. And on the rule of law.

Have you told the European Ombudsman?

Have you told your MEP?
pip2
29th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
"Won't allow you" to what?

Have you looked at the Court of Justice of the EU's judgement on article 50?

No country can be forced to join the EU. Or the other way.
pip2
22nd Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
The Lisbon Treaty was signed by David Milband and Gordon Brown in 2007. It came into force in November 2009.

The post by 'speeednet' below has been copied pasted from a known hoax email. It's also been shared on Facebook and other websites.

Even the opening sentence 'why is no-one talking about' has been seen countless times before.

Everything in the post below is 100% false.
Speeednet
21st Apr 2019
-4
Thanks for voting!
WHY IS NOBODY TALKING ABOUT THE LISBON TREATY, THE TREATY THAT COMES INTO FORCE 2020, ITS WORSE THAN THE SO CALLED DEAL, IF 99% OF THE BRITISH THINK TERESA MAYS DEAL IS BAD, JUST LOOK AT THE LISBON TREATY. PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW, LEAVERS AND REMAIN
..“What will actually happen if we stay in the EU” is a question no remainer will ever answer but here it is warts and all.
Check it out if you wish ——>>
1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed.
2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s.
3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty.
4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.)
5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK.
6: The UK will adopt 100% of whatever the EU Parliament and ECJ lays down without any means of abstention or veto, negating the need for the UK to have the Lords or even the Commons as we know it today.
7: The UK will NOT be able to make its own trade deals.
8: The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade tariffs.
9 The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade quotas.
10: The UK loses control of its fishing rights
11: The UK loses control of its oil and gas rights
12: The UK loses control of its borders and enters the Schengen region by 2022 - as clearly laid down in the Lisbon treaty
13: The UK loses control of its planning legislation
14: The UK loses control of its armed forces including its nuclear deterrent
15: The UK loses full control of its taxation policy
16: The UK loses the ability to create its own laws and to implement them
17: The UK loses its standing in the Commonwealths
18: The UK loses control of any provinces or affiliated nations e.g.: Falklands, Cayman Islands, Gibraltar etc
19: The UK loses control of its judicial system
20: The UK loses control of its international policy
21: The UK loses full control of its national policy
22: The UK loses its right to call itself a nation in its own right.
23: The UK loses control of its space exploration program
24: The UK loses control of its Aviation and Sea lane jurisdiction
25: The UK loses its rebate in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon treaty
26: The UK’s contribution to the EU is set to increase by an average of 1.2bn pa and by 2.3bn pa by 2020
This is the future that the youths of today think we stole from them?
They should be on their knees thanking us for saving them from being turned into Orwellian automatons!
Forget Deals no deals its time for remainers and brexiteers to unite and see whats coming before its to late. This is the whole reason they are dragging brexit out. So we can get to 2020 then we have no choices anynore.
Yodama
21st Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Excellent and concise post. Not much time left to get out of this toxic marriage.
Yodama
22nd Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
And...we will have to sing their National anthem ( Wagner's) Ode to Joy.
Yodama
22nd Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Oops not Wagner....Schiller!
pip2
22nd Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Thank you for the copy and paste.

Please see the actual Lisbon Treaty in EUR-Lex.

EUR-Lex is the website run by the European Commission.
pip2
22nd Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Nonsense made up post.
latin
26th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Excellent!
Can’t grt the Dow ticks and up ticks to work.., strange !
Hyacynth
4th May 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
ARG
24th May 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Sorry, all absolute tripe. Please quote reliable sources, not alt-right propaganda.
pip2
18th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Who are these people? 'Speeednet'? 'Yodama'?

Could these two usernames actually be the same person?

Or even, not even people at all?

Just mobile phones in a rack in a data centre run by a program?

"Behind the button, no-one knows who you are".

I am real. I am Phil Jones and I am here because of my own future and that of my step grandchildren. And my older brother's children one of whom is now 19.

Next Pulse of Europe meetup in High Wycombe: Sunday 5 May. Council of Europe day. I'll be there. 2 pm, Church St. You can meet me.

Can you meet 'Yodama'? Can you meet 'Speeednet'? Or are they nothing more than pixels? An illusion?
Yodama
19th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Wow! a personal attack on me ( and my alter-ego speednet) yet again dear pip, hint of paranoia methinks.

Your thinking is definitely off kilter.
Strangely you know about rows of mobile phones on racks, is that what you are using?
"Honi soit qui mal y pense" rings true eh?

The whole idea of this website is to be anonymous, how have you not understood that?
Speeednet
19th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
If you were truly worried for your children and grand children's future, you would pull your head out of the place where the sun don't shine and do some homework of your own, other than the propaganda spouted by the MSM on behalf of the globalist NWO. You can start by turning off the BBC and cancel your subscription to the Guardian.

The rest of Europe is starting to see that they have been sold a pup, the EU or the common market as it was sold to us, is the embodiment of the Kalergi plan. (google is your friend)

Your grand children will be little more than serfs, worker ants, providing for the master race, the chosen few at the top of the pyramid. If they pull off this con, but as I say the peoples of mainland Europe are also waking up.

So each morning, rather than thinking of insults to throw at people with a different viewpoint to yours, like the clearly more enlightened than you Yodama and myself. You should be getting down on your knees and praying that people like us are able to stop this nightmare from happening.
pip2
19th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Kalergi was a good man. Quote:

"One of the most convinced champions of European unity was Count Richard Coudenhove-Kalergi (1894-1972), the son of an Austrian diplomat and his Japanese wife, and co-founder in 1922 of the Pan-European Union.

In his 1923 manifesto 'Paneuropa', Coudenhove-Kalergi argued in favour of large-scale co-operation within a network of five 'global power fields': the Americas (excluding Canada), the Soviet Union, Eastern Asia (China and Japan), Paneuropa (including continental Europe's colonies in Africa and southeast Asia), and Britain and its empire.

He proposed a four-stage process for the achievement of European union: a conference of representatives for the 26 European states, the agreement of treaties for the settlement of European disputes, the development of a customs union, and the drafting of a federal European constitution.

He also suggested that English should become the common second language for Europe, since it was becoming the dominant global language.

His ideas failed to generate a mass following, but they impressed several leading figures in the arts, as well as several contemporary or future political leaders including George Pompidou, Thomas Masaryk, Konrad Adenauer, Winston Churchill and two French prime ministers, Edouard Herriot and Aristide Briand".

-- "Understanding the European Union", John McCormick, 5th edition. Page 30. In chapter "The idea of Europe".
pip2
19th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
The European Union publishes its work.

A list of all the people there is in whoiswho.europa.eu. Staff directory.

Questions? Try Europe Direct. There's even a phone number. And Europe House in London.

The EU is contactable. Accountable. Transparent.
Speeednet
21st Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Clearly your spin doctor credentials are up to date. And now for some facts about said Kalergi.

Kalergi proclaims the need to abolish the right of nations to self-determination and outlines the break-up of nation states through the use of ethnic separatist movements and the destruction of the nations themselves through mass migration. In order for Europe to be easily controlled by the future elite, Kalergi proposes the creation of a homogeneous mixed breed population, and as to who should be the new elite? Kalergi is particularly illuminating on this point:

The man of the future will be of mixed race. The races and classes of today will gradually disappear due to the elimination of space, time, and prejudice. The Eurasian-negroid race of the future, similar in appearance to the Ancient Egyptians, will replace the current diversity of peoples and the diversity of individuals. Instead of destroying European Judaism, Europe, against her will, refined and educated this people, driving them to their future status as a leading nation through this artificial evolutionary process. It’s not surprising that the people that escaped from the Ghetto-Prison, became the spiritual nobility of Europe. Thus, the compassionate care given by Europe created a new breed of aristocrats. This happened when the European feudal aristocracy crashed because of the emancipation of the Jews [due to the actions taken by the French Revolution]

Although no textbook mentions Kalergi, his ideas are the guiding principles of the European Union. The belief that the peoples of Europe should be mixed with Africans and Asians, to destroy our identity, to break down traditional ways of living and create a single mixed race, is the reason for community policies that promote minority interests. The underlying motives are not at all humanitarian, because the driving power behind the ruthless regime dominating the EU, plans the greatest genocide in history.
pip2
22nd Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
That's not what my textbook says.
latin
26th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Try to down thumb your comment ...strange that , I bet if I up ticked it works!
Have you ever thought you could go and live in the EU and help to keep funding the Federalist dream!
I don’t want that for my heirs or family and I am sure I don’t want to have centralised government.
Which country do you know whose citizens are really happy under federalism and centralisation!
Ridiculous to say it’s better than democracy absolutely ridiculous.
I don’t see Australia New Zealand Canada America or hardly any all country’s choosing centralisation and Federayas it always ends in tears
Look up what Gorbachev warned us about.
latin
26th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
It publishes what it wants you to know!
I note it dosent publish where our tax goes and dosent have accounts dined off, days it all!
Federalists at work’
latin
26th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I have upticked you but of course not working!
You should have many up ticks but as not working we will never know!
I have read all of this that you write and all those remainers know about it , but people like Blair Heseltine Clarke etc etc all have vested interests so certainly muddy the waters as they don’t intend to lose out !
Also so much of civil servants jobs are shipped out to Brussels also MPs jobs and none of them want to go back to all the work they used to do !
Shocking state of affairs, but we will leave regardless of Brexit being high jacked by Remainers who hate democracy!
All helped by Brussels it’s self !
latin
26th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Good to see someone is able to use the World Wide Web to research this conversation.
It’s out there for all remainers to see!
They deny it though as it’s not what they want to hear and know,and they must not let the surfs know that!
Macron has called for faster centralisation and Army total corruption.
latin
26th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Mine does and all the internet does it’s well known... not hidden..
Shame you haven’t got an MP who could help you research it , it’s not denied just not talked about !
Speeednet
17th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
This is quite a read, no doubt some that voted remain will be happy at the prospect, but anybody with an ounce of integrity should be appalled, whichever way they voted.

https://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2019/04/15/explosive-slog-special-how-may-was-installed-how-she-hid-defence-ties-to-the-eu-how-the-media-lied-about-the-october-brextension/
Yodama
18th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Very interesting article Speednet. Don't think mainstream media ( BBC) would allow this.
pip2
18th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Are you replying to your other username?
Speeednet
17th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The political classes in Westminster have shown their total disregard for the people they are supposed to represent.

They need a reminder of who pays their wages and I think in the forthcoming elections, local and hahahahaa the EU, both Labour and Conservatives will get a bit of a wake up call.

However their skin is so thick (along with some of the members) that it will not make a ha'p'orth of difference and they will do what they want, which seems to be, keeping us shackled to the EU for ever.
pip2
17th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
We are leading players. Major players. In the EU.

Sanctions, for example.

Sanctions work better when done together.

Like the EU wide ban on handling gold from North Korea's banks.

A list of all EU sanctions in force: sanctionsmap.eu.

I am Phil Jones and I live in High Wycombe.
Speeednet
18th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
We are major players in the World, not just the EU and why should our World policies be decided by unelected bureaucrats in Brussels?

Surely even the morons in Westminster could still embargo gold from NK if they thought it was a good idea, without a dictate from the EU.
pip2
18th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
EU sanctions are decided by national government ministers.

All published.

In the Official Journal.

So that all the world knows what is happening.

That's why the EU is respected around the world.

A serious and credible organisation.
Speeednet
19th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
"A serious and credible organisation."

Which is so rotten to the core, that they have not found an accountant anywhere in Europe bent enough to sign off their accounts.
pip2
19th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The accounts of the EU have been "signed off" every year since 2007,

Have you read the first report of the Court of Auditors? For 1977-8?

I have. It says that yes some things were wrong. And had to be put right. Like amounts "incorrectly classified on the balance sheet".

It's because the EU is so open that all problems like this have been made known. That's how to build trust.
Speeednet
21st Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Signing off your own accounts don't count.
latin
26th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
That’s not how Federalists and Centralisation and federalism works!
Think you need to look up what the EU is about and why it will not work!
The world is not clambering to be Federalist states, but small country can be bought by the EU throwing our cash at them!
pip2
29th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
The Court of Auditors is independent.

Its credibility depends on its independence.
pip2
29th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
In the 1960s the UK was the sick man of Europe.

Since joining the UK has got better.

Thanks to things like the EU financial services passport. Part of EU free movement.

So whose 'cash' is it?

Besides, being in EU is about values.

Human rights. Democracy. Solidarity. Non-discrimination. The rule of law.

These are things you cannot buy.
CuriousKate
17th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
I'm ambiguous on this point as I am about whether we remain or go, but I would like to ask all people who voted leave, what they thought at the time of voting about issues related to things like the Irish backstop, the European Search Warrant (if I've got the name right) satellite air defences (again, not sure of the name but didn't we do most to create a good system for the EU and now will have to start all over again with creating our own) etc.

I'm all for democracy, but let's have a second referendum at a time when we all know the facts so that the result is a true reflection of what we believe. Then we can go with whatever result knowing that everyone has given an informed judgement. In my opinion that's true democracy.

As for leaving giving us our sovereignty etc. Please! All we've done is made ourselves a world laughing stock. Let's live in the real 21st century world, not in the past!

Have a nice day!
pip2
17th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Galileo satellite programme, Kate?

Switzerland has a partnership agreement with EU so Switzerland can use Galileo.

But the running and admin of the programme is only for EU member countries to do.
TrudyLS
19th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Trouble is we don't know the facts and anybody who thinks they do is delusional , there is no way all the facts will be revealed because it would undermine too many of the elites agenda
pip2
19th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
I don't understand what you mean?
TrudyLS
19th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
for every argument that is put forward a counter argument is given, why, because those putting forward their argument or opinion do so to win the vote for their own side. so, unless you are a superior being of some sort , you cant know everything and therefore knowing all the facts is an impossibility.
pip2
20th Apr 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
Well one of the benefits of EU law is legal certainty.

For example. The European Commission has done a good job of spelling out the legal consequences of no agreement. What is called 'no deal' in the newspapers.

They're called Notices to Stakeholders. On flights, medicines, cross-border pensions, road transport...

The European Parliament has published its impact studies. I read the one about fishing,

It says that a lot of workers on British boats are citizens of other EU countries so what about their workers' rights?
latin
26th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Ambiguity? Look up the meaning... you aren’t ambiguous.
You are a fully fleshed remainer and I would like to ask you a question, where is the EU heading ?Where is our cash going ?
How many projects have they funded witour cash and where is the full list !
Why are accounts not audited?
Why do they want more centralisation more Federalism?
Why are they not happy with just trading why all the centralisation!
Why do they want to centralise all country’s taxes ?
What makes them think they can keep pushing Russia, I work with many from the Balkans and they support Putin .
This stupid Federalist dream will end in tragedy .
Also the EU have not kept peace as they claim, it’s NATO that has done that.
latin
26th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
We know facts if we research!
pip2
29th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The EU accounts are open and audited.

Published in the EU budget 2017 financial report.

Income. Expenditure. Budget limits. It's all in there.

The reports of the Court of Auditors are all published. The Court also works with national audit bodies.

The EU has an oversight role on tax. But the tax you pay is set by your national government. The EU does not directly set taxes or collect them.

https://europa.eu/european-union/topics/taxation_en

Did you know the European Commission is looking at reducing, yes, reducing, the number of things it does? It's published. It's called the subsidiarity review.

What does the principle of subsidiarity mean? It means the EU is to do only what can only be best done together.

Everything else is the job of each country.

Proportionality means the EU does only the minimum.

To change the principles of subsidiarity and proportionality would mean a completely new set of treaties approved by every member country.
pip2
29th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Where is the full list of EU projects?

Have a look at "Essential principles on financial settlement". Easy to find online.

Lists every one of the EU's institutions, agencies, funds, programmes, joint ventures.

All of this has always been available.

NATO has a vital job. But for security, often your first response cannot and should not be military.

See Vidar Helgensen's article in 2015 for Open Democracy. It's called "A Norwegian View".
RabHaw
17th Apr 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
There is a general " leave alone " attitude prevailing amongst the Westminster based parties which sadly tends to ignore the fact that the Good Friday Agreement is currently in danger of being allowed of falling into disrepair Sadly the blindly incompetent Mrs May has a total lack of knowledge of the history of Ireland bribing and attempting to gain support of the UDP - narrow minded biased bigots who support that repulsive bunch of religious bigots the Orange Order and their off shoots the Apprentice Boys whose poisonous behaviour towards fellow Christians is quite repulsive and who this Easter week end will parade through streets in the UK .in their silly suits and bowler hats ! Disgraceful !
RabHaw
15th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
The Referendum was flawed with proven misdemeanours from the leave campaign . Follow the action of the Swiss Government with regard to such actions and declare it null and void- we are a small country and EU membership is to our advantage !
pip2
15th Apr 2019
6
Thanks for voting!
Good for you and help keep the Good Friday Agreement.

Did you know that as well as single market and customs union there is also the "EU programme for peace and reconciliation in NI and the border region"?

Did you know that in the GFA both governments agreed to be neutral in NI?

And that "participation in EU programmes" is mentioned in the GFA? It doesn't name any particular ones, it just gives examples.
Colkeeper
14th Apr 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
I voted to remain and have claimed that in spite of the referendum result GB wont leave the EU. Time will tell.
Yodama
14th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Too much rhetoric is solving nothing, time for some
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz's
pip2
13th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Elections and polls are a job for each EU member country to do on its own.
Yodama
13th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Speaking of old voters dying off!

UTTERLY SHAMEFUL REMAINIAC BEHAVIOUR FROM:

Polly Toynbee, a remain journalist with the Guardian, who was ecstatic at the death of older leavers, she said:

"Enough old leavers will have died and enough young Remainers will have come on to the electoral register to turn the dial on what the country thinks about Brexit.

A SHAMEFUL tea towel was produced displaying the heads of old people with the inscription "Those who voted for Brexit are now dead."

A recent study from Cambridge University Scientists studied the neural network developement of 18-24 year old brains , and found adulthood was not reached until their 30's.

Says a lot about 75% of 18-24 immature age group of the remain voters.
Not A clue what the vote was about or what it entailed.
Probably thought it was another game to twitter to all their pals LOL, LOL, LOL.

As they "grow up" they will start thinking about the future and change their votes.

My head is bleeding from the amount of scratching I have been doing. Why are remaniacs in such denial of the fact that we voted to leave and when are they going to accept the damn vote??
Roof Top Crow
14th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I seem to have hit a nerve.

The 1975 referendum was 44 years ago. In that democratic vote, 67% voted to stay in membership and 33% voted to leave.

In the 2016 referendum, 52% of voters reversed that democratic decision. Democracy at work.

In your last paragraph you talk of democracy. Democracy keeps working and the leave decision taken in 2016 might be democratically reversed in the next referendum or election. Again, that is how democracy works.

I do not understand why it is shameful to think of older voters dying off. I am an older voter, I was born in 1944. Polly Toynbee was born in 1946, she is also an older voter.

I do not know Polly Toynbee, but I am sure, that just like me, she knows that at our age, most of our life is now behind us.
Yodama
14th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Yes 44 years ago! The Europhiles have been partying long enough, time enough to offer Britain as a sacrifice.
Time to go.

If democracy is working as you say , then why are you not honouring the result of 2016?

No you have not hit any of my nerves RTC, I think someone else was playing on my last nerve.
I am beginning to find this comical now!
Roof Top Crow
14th Apr 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
My understanding of this Brexit chaos, is that the Conservative Government have been trying to honour the result of the 2016 referendum, but without success.

The lack of success in achieving this objective is due to the lack of skill and leadership being shown by the Prime Minister. A Prime Minister the Conservative Party elected.

In your second paragraph you are asking why I am not honouring the result of the 2016 referendum. My only involvement in the referendum was to walk to my local school and vote.

Since the 2016 referendum I have watched in amazement and dismay as many of the elected Members of Parliament, who sit on the Conservative Government side of the house, have shown themselves to be charlatans and self-seeking opportunists.
Yodama
14th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Dry and droll Rooftop, I find myself agreeing with you on the conduct of our PM and the Mp's. Disgraceful behaviour. My thoughts exactly charlatans and self-seeking opportunists.
Unfortunately they are all we have at present. we the people voted them in. Stuck with them for now.

I am aware that your only involvement was to vote, why did you vote, what is the point of voting?
Had the remain side won, they would be very angry if a second, third, fourth ( ad nauseam ) vote was called for .
Bottom line, leave vote won, so honour it, or in your case...try to accept it . Whether it was a majority of 1 is irrelevant, leave won.

We feel betrayed not only by our politicians and the Eu who have made things as difficult as possible, but by our own people who cannot and will not accept the result.

I ask, are these endless arguments solving anything at all? As you so dryly state, all you did was to vote.

Perhaps the stock markets will have a run on blood pressure tablets and we will have run out due to the EU stockpiling.

If Macron has his way, they would cut us out within the hour.
We begged to be let in and now we are begging to be let out. A theatre of farce.

A question... did we legally leave the EU on 29 March and is the extesion TM asked for thereby illegal?
Watch this space!
pip2
17th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Being in the EU does this country a lot of good.

Of course the UK should be in.

Support our neighbours.
Roof Top Crow
13th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
I keep reading and hearing that the votes of 17.4 million people in a 2016 referendum represents the will of the people. It did not then and it does not now.

17.4 million “Leave” votes represent 37% of the 46.5 million people who were able to vote in the 2016 referendum or 26% of 66 million people who lived in the UK in 2016. This tells us that these low percentage numbers from 2016 never represented the will of the people of the UK.

Three years later this spurious claim now just represents the view of a declining number of “Leave” voters, and nothing more. I say declining because the middle-aged and elderly, who made up the majority of “Leave” voters, also make up most of the 500,000 (1360 a day) UK citizens that die every year.

The demographics over the past 3 years are complex, but they tell a straightforward story. There are more “Leave” voters dying every day than “Remainers”. The cross over point was late in 2018 and if there was a referendum in 2019 that asked the same “ in or out “ question, remain would poll more votes.

I do not want to be overly morbid, but once people have died, the vote they cast in any kind of election cannot be taken into account. If we do not do that, we may as well go back to the referendum in 1973 when the yes vote was 67% and the no vote was 32%.
TrudyLS
13th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
may as well ban all elections and just crack on with a dictatorship , follow your logic and there is no point voting for anything
Roof Top Crow
13th Apr 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
In the UK there have been 27 elections since 1918. Legislation is in place to ensure we have regular general elections. The maximum period between general elections is five years.

The issues that influence voters change all the time. Societies values change, circumstances change and voters make their decisions accordingly.

In 2019 we would not want our representational parliament working with voting decisions that where made in the twenties, thirties and forties or through to the nineties.
TrudyLS
13th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
so now your saying the vote was valid and we should leave ?
pip2
13th Apr 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Thank you Roof Top.

Did you know the 1950 general election had an 83% turnout?

The 2016 EU referendum had a turnout of less than 73%.

"Every general election from 1945 to 1992 (except 1970) had a higher turnout than the 2016 referendum".

Please see PMP magazine, "Was the 2016 referendum really ‘the biggest democratic exercise in this country’s history’?" on 14 March 2019.
Speeednet
19th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Those that chose not to vote, chose to go with the majority by default. So factor in their number to your spurious equation.
pip2
29th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
There may be a good reason to abstain by not voting.

Perhaps because you don't feel you have enough information to make an informed choice.

At the London march I heard of someone who had flown in from Greece to protest because he didn't get a vote.
pip2
29th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
But because of the referendum result the MPs in Westminster have done things they would never have done otherwise.

And one thing it has done is it has made me realise how incredibly badly informed I was.

I've taken the work of the EU and its predecessors for granted.

No longer.

Standing up for EU.
RabHaw
13th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
The whole Brexit business has been shockingly handled by Mrs May . It was a flawed Referendum with the Leavers presenting the public with deliberately flawed information . They were fined by the Courts for mis-representation! Nuff said !
Speeednet
29th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Unlike the reaminers that didn't do a thing wrong, told the absolute truth, didn't exaggerate anything at all, didn't get a raft of foreigners to lie including the POTUS and didn't send a propaganda leaflet into every home in the country.
Bluebird55
12th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Yodama and many others, keep using the figure of 17.4 million as the reason why we must leave. Whereas I accept that was a majority vote, it is most definitely not a huge vote... and nowhere near big enough to use it as any kind of lever. The fact that such a small majority voted to leave three years ago, means that this 17.4 figure is pretty insignificant now. As a remain supporter, I do honestly sympathise with the leavers, and the way this has all been mishandled, and we should have gone by now. But for whatever reason, we haven't, and we are now all able to see the pitfalls. Also, some of us have died off whilst others have come of age, so we must have another vote. It is the only sensible option left.
Yodama
12th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Whether it was a small majority or not Bluebird, it was a majority and should be respected as such.
I really don't see 17 .4 million people as pretty insignificant. Most of them have woken to the fact that we joined the EEC under a blanket of cover ups and lies as to what we were REALLY entering into and now want out.

Why have votes on anything at all if the parties who lose refuse to accept it?
Ignoring the wishes of a majority vote leads to the anarchy we have in our houses of Parliament and among our peoples.
Should the vote have gone the other way, how would you have reacted to the same behaviour that the Brexiteer's are having to deal with?

Just by the way, there were young and old voters who voted out, so I don't think funeral parlours are going to be awash with droves of dying Brexiteer's anytime soon.

Pitfalls? That information comes from the media, it is heavily slanted toward remain so "project fear" has been ramped up to drive this agenda of doom and failure.

Britain will be doing very well indeed after we leave the rigid constraints of the EU.
Just today major bankers declared business would flourish world-wide when we leave. They said it would be a "challenge" but not as devastating as the media claim.
Business is ready and geared up to succeed, it is just the obfuscation and procrastination of both Parliament and the EU that is causing business to remain in a state of limbo. Business just want to get on with it.

The saddest thing of all is the attacks on people who voted in all honesty, for what they believe in.

Another referendum? Careful what you wish for, many more now want to leave.
Bluebird55
12th Apr 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
I agree with many things you say, Yodama, especially the last sentence, and I will have no problems if a second referendum confirms the result of the first, but I think we need to know.

Most people who voted leave, wouldn't have known about soft Brexits and hard Brexits (I certainly didn't), we were just asked "In or out?" Now we know a lot more about it. It sounds undemocratic to ignore the views of the majority, and I don't want to do that, I just want to know what the majority feel about it now.
Yodama
12th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Wish I had a crystal ball Bluebird. The EU makes a habit of forcing countries into second referendums. This is a strange kind of divorce. I think we knew from the outset that it would be difficult extricating ourselves..all the time expecting some kind of jiggery pokery and roadblocks.
That they wish to punish us into submission is evident.

We flourished before the EU so I can't understand why everyone is so afraid.
We have been brainwashed into thinking we cannot manage without the EU...only 27 countries out of 193 to trade with? So many emerging markets to be trading with. Why wear a EU corset where we are hampered by their rules and regulations?

I think this stitch-up must be addressed, the people are furious now. I know remainers who just want to leave now, this prolonged process is wearing people down....so they think!
Apparently, in a recent survey at least 78% want to hurry up and leave.
Apologies for my ranting, it is born of frustration and anger.
Bluebird55
13th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
No need to apologise for ranting. Nothing will ever change without a few ranters.
pip2
13th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Thank you Bluebird.

I am one of the 16 million who wanted to stay in the poll in 2016.
pip2
14th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
The only powers the EU has are given to it by its members.

The European Union can only do what is allowed. What there is a legal basis for.

In which of the European treaties did national leaders agree to let other member countries require an election or poll in their own country?

The EU has no competence in the area of elections and polls in member countries.

In other words, to use the jargon, "elections and polls are an exclusive competence of member states".

The EU only acts behalf of the member countries where there is a legal base for it to do so.
Bluebird55
14th Apr 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Yodama: one of your previous sentences read, "We flourished before the EU so I can't understand why everyone is so afraid." To answer that, it might be worthwhile going back even further in time, when the common market was first born. It wasn't just about six countries trading together, it was all about former enemies tying their economy so close that they would never go to war again. We weren't part of that common market, but we were part of two world wars that were fought, mainly in Europe. If the common market/EC/EU hasn't succeeded in every walk of life, it has certainly succeeded in helping to keep peace. Isn't that worth saving?
Speeednet
29th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
And as Tony Blair says, "keep voting until we get it right". PS That "small majority" was well over a million people.
Hyacynth
5th May 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
We did not flourish before we joined Europe!!!

How old are you ? I was there !

The UK was in turmoil in the 70s when we joined....look it up. One of the several prime ministers we had through that time ..Callaghan, said that if he were a young man he would emigrate.

Where do leavers get this idea that we enjoyed some Halcyon age until the EU ? We were stoney broke and our entire infrastructure was disintegrating. We have since flourished in the EU.

Having said that, this wealth has not been fairly distributed and our social problems have not been addressed but this has nothing to do with the EU , just our successive inept and corrupt governments

When we joined and 3 years later voted to remain we were known as The Sick Man of Europe and a complete laughing stock. I voted remain then and was stunned that the EU let us !

And as to <> Where does that come from ??

I'm going to bed ...
Yodama
12th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
This whole argument is becoming like the Lilliputians and Blefuscun's going to war over which end of the egg should be opened.
It is out of control of the average voter.. our votes don't matter it seems so ....
pip2
11th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
The great thing about European Parliament elections is every vote counts.

No worries about wasted votes here.

The sister party of the UK Greens in the European Parliament is the group of Greens and European Free Alliance. Its leader: Phillipe Lamberts MEP.

For the Labour Party it's the Socialists and Democrats Group (S&D). Its leader, Udo Bullmann MEP.

For the centre right ie Conservatives in the manner of John Major and Michael Heseltine it's the European People's Party (EPP). Its leader: Manfred Weber MEP.

For Lib Dems its the Alliance of Liberals and Democrats for Europe (ALDE). Its leader, Guy Verhofstadt MEP.

There are 7 main groups in the European Parliament. Out of 751 seats there are 55 MEPs who don't belong to a group ie non-attached members,

For more please see 'The European Parliament: the Citizens' Voice in the EU' from EU Publications Office.
pip2
11th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Your difficulty is that the referendum result just raised new questions.

It didn't say what to do with the result.

What about citizens' rights? The special status of Northern Ireland? Financial settlement?

What about all the EU agencies, funds and programmes like the Agricultural Guarantee Fund? The European Banking Authority? The European Medicines Agency? The Aviation Safety Agency? The Natura 2000 wildlife programme?

There are 7 institutions. 7 supporting bodies. 45 agencies.

You have had 3 years to answer these and lots more questions. A letter in today's Times newspaper said, "Revoke article 50 and give us our lives back".
Yodama
11th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
The referendum result raised new questions??

What it did was to uncover a very real coup- a tiptoe takeover by a Federal state.
pip2
11th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Implement what?

What's your answer to the Irish border?

You want to be in the customs union? The single market? The Euratom treaty on nuclear materials? The Galileo satellite programme?

You want to be in all of the customs union? Including agriculture?
pip2
11th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The European Union is not a federal system like the USA because all its members are independent countries.

But it is more than a loose group like the United Nations.

The EU as it is now is that way because that's what its members want.

Same in the future. The EU is run by and for its members. It can only become what its members want it to be.

Should the UK join all of enhanced cooperation? Should it sign the treaty on stability coordination and governance?
Yodama
10th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
One of the main reasons I want to leave as quickly as possible.
Remainer's should not watch this elephant in the room.

https://youtu.be/O-QtgtXJxYQ
pip2
11th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
I'd rather not follow dodgy links thank you.

My name is Phil Jones and I live in High Wycombe. If you live in the area you may have seen my name on the letters page of Bucks Free Press.

Would you like to come and see us in High Wycombe high street? 2 pm, 1st and 3rd Sundays.

Who are you, 'yodama'? Where do you live?
Yodama
11th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
While I admire your missionary zeal in attempting to confound and subvert the wishes of 17.4 British people, I think your insult to the people who make films about their concerns of belonging to the European Union as Dodgy, shows your complete lack of understanding of just how many - dodgy- academics, politicians and people of standing feel about a dangerous group of people.

DODGY- Rodney Atkinson BA MSc MIL
Author, Political Economist, Occasional Ministerial Adviser,
Parliamentary Candidate, Businessman
Freenations movement.

Main Areas of Expertise:
Europe and the British Constitution, The Euro
Resurgence of Continental Fascism
Macro Economic Policy -
Government intervention, Industrial policy, International Trade, Interest Rates, Exchange Rate Policy.
Energy Policy, Regional Development Policy

DODGY - Sir Patrick Moore foreword to film prior to referendum. Quote:
If your'e British, this film is about you every one of you. Something is happening in Britain which increasingly intrudes into the way you live.
Traditional customs, familiar and patterns of a liberal and compassionate society, the British way of doing things, all are disappearing and being replaced by a frustrating avalanche of alien regulation and bureaucracy.
This is happening not by popular demand, but as a result of British membership of the European Union.
The very character of our unique way of life is being destroyed. And as there has been no public debate conversation or approval.
The people appearing in this film are not politicians or civil servants, they don't seek your vote or your money, they only ask that you watch and listen and make up your own mind.

All that you are about to hear has been hidden from you, all that you are about to hear is the truth.

Offering me sweeties to enter your offices in High Wycombe where I may have me brainwashed before I am aware of it? Thank you for the invitation but no thanks.
As to who I am or where I am is of no concern to you.
Yodama
11th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
You ask.
"Who are you 'yodama'? Where do you live?
Vere are your paper's? " ( Now where have I heard that before?)
Are you and your fascist buddies coming to arrest me?
Seems as if you have been in the company of the EU far too long.
pip2
11th Apr 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Years ago I went to a lecture given by Patrick Moore about astronomy.

I was surprised and disappointed later, whenI heard Moore had the political views of a crank. Sorry.

The EU is a legal body. It can only do what is allowed. Everything decided is published, with the legal base.

That is why the EU is respected around the world as a serious organisation.
pip2
11th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
'Yodama' avoids the question.

I am also a member of European Movement UK.

Fair criticism of the European Union is welcome. How else can it be improved?
Yodama
12th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
One man's crank is another man's Einstein...
Because everyone doesn't hold the same views as you, doesn't make them cranks.
How insulting!!
Yodama
12th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Ahhh! A George Soros backed organisation. Speaks reams.
parsnip54
6th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
People of the United Kingdom. We are still the same people who have helped shape the world for centuries. Surely can we not unite again as a nation and sort this unholy mess out that is rapidly tearing this beautiful country apart by accepting a second referendum so we can, as a nation, all vote to ensure that the so-called government who only seems to be interested in their own politically agendas, are absolutely clear on what we, as a nation, want.
I realise we have voted on this before but we now, I feel, have a better understanding of what the implications are by leaving or staying in the EU means. Let’s now show our European neighbours that we are a strong and meaningful United Kingdom and stand together with our voice.
TrudyLS
13th Apr 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
problem is we have been told so many lies and scare stories its even harder to know who to believe. I don't want another vote, just want it all over
jeaniembe
5th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
We didn't know what we were voting for! Well I did and so did everyone else I've spoken to. Also I know what I will be doing at the next election.
pip2
5th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Is your view the same as this?

"We fought two world wars not to be ruled by Germany, and now we are l they are doing just that".

Shocking comment I got by email today.

How is EU law made? "How the EU works" by EU Publications Office says it needs:

1) At least 55% of member countries ie 16 out of 28 in favour. AND with at least 65% of the total population.

Germany is just one country. With only 15.93% of the total population. 2014 figures.

2) For most but not all things, a majority of the directly elected European Parliament as well.

And the EP is run on political groups. Not on national lines.

Another safeguard: only the European Commission can formally start a proposal to make EU law. It's independent. To work for all the members equally.

AND

There can only be a proposal if it is covered by the treaties. The agreements signed voluntarily by every national leader. And then approved by every national parliament. This is called the legal base.

Everything decided is published. With the legal base.
Lionel
5th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
"We fought two world wars not to be ruled by Germany..."

I'm a Jewish man. I lost family in the Holocaust. I lost family fighting for a free Europe.

Make your case.
pip2
6th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I'm sorry to hear it.

Simone Veil, the first president of the European Parliament, lost most of her family in the Holocaust.
Lionel
6th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
No case then!

Another Europhile lame duck.
pip2
6th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
How does the European Union help to secure the peace?

1) A court for the settlement of disputes;
2) A body of law with 60 years' experience behind it.
3) A directly elected House to help bring the peoples of Europe together,
4) An independent Commission to think about and work for the interests of Europe as a whole.
5) A body to stand up for common values of democracy, solidarity, equality, non-discrimination, human rights and the rule of law.

To name a few. All of these things are achievements.

Now we know.
pip2
9th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Well first of all would you like to own what you have to say? My name is Phil Jones and I run Pulse of Europe in High Wycombe. Come and see us on the 1st and 3rd Sunday of the month. 2 pm, Church St.

The EU single market is far larger than any of its member countries. For instance, the population of Germany is less than 16% of the total population of all the EU countries.

One of the benefits is it doesn't matter whether goods arrive at Trieste in Italy or Rotterdam in Netherlands or Harwich. Once it is inside the single market then it can legally go anywhere in the EU countries with no further charges.

But this is not a free-for-all. Countries can check anything at any time. It's not at the expense of security.

The EU's Rapid Alert system lets other member countries know whenever one country sees dangerous imports like fake medicines or toys that don't meet safety standards.

Free movement rules help businesses as well as people. Like the financial services passport that helps City of London banks. UK based airlines can fly from Milan to Rome.

Consumer protections makes it easier to buy things across borders. There's also police and judicial co-operation.

British book authors are protected by EU rules on copyrights. Boxes of fish caught in Cornwall are immediately legal for sale in Spain.

Someone in Spain brought a case against Google Spain in the Court of Justice of the EU and that is part of why the GDPR is the way it is now.

All these benefits means there are some admin jobs to do. Like collecting figures on how much orange juice has been imported to the single market from the rest of the world.

Someone has to do it. So the job is for the European Commission to do. That's one of its jobs.

Another of the Commission's jobs is to formally make proposals for new or changed EU law. It has to be impartial. That's so that no-one can say that any country is telling any other country what to do.

All this has been agreed by national leaders, by national parliaments, by government ministers, by elected citizens... democratically. To make a better Europe.
pip2
9th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Oh, by the way, where does the 16% figure come from? Population of Germany compared to the rest of EU?

It's in "The European Union explained - how the European Union works" from EU Publications Office. 2014 figures.
pip2
9th Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Oh I should also add that there is an EU-NATO relations committee in the European Parliament.

Why? Because better roads built with EU regional development fund money can be used by citizens and also by armies.

There's EU-UN partnership as well.

What anonymous author 'scandiman' (real name? where?) misses is that there are loads of things to do with security where your first response is not and cannot be military.

Like Vidar Helgesen of Norway said in his article for Open Democracy. It's called "A Norwegian View" in 2015. That's all you need to find it online.

Like EU sanctions against Crimea and Sevastopol. There's a list of all EU sanctions in force: sanctionsmap.eu.
Yodama
10th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Who was Walter Hallstein then?
Yodama
10th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
You have failed to mention Walter Hallstein, check out his roots if you dare.
pip2
11th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
No answer! 'Lionel' has no answer?
Josiew
5th Apr 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
I am absolutely disgusted too by the antics of our MP's. They have tried everything in their power to stop or reverse the decision of all of us who voted to leave the EU.

The most outrageous suggestion was that we did not know what we were voting for, as though over 17 million people were stupid.

I knew exactly what I was voting for, as I imagine most people did. I think we cold have made a better job of it ourselves. We certainly could not have done worse
Herb
5th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
If negotiations with the EU had been conducted by. competent people who wanted to give effect to the referendum result we would not have to make this choice and did our rime minister not tell us repeatedly that no deal is better than a bad deal?
pip2
5th Apr 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Now we know.

About citizens' rights. Northern Ireland. The Good Friday Agreement, The single market. The customs union. Farm support. Fisheries.

EU regulation on flights, food safety, animal welfafe, copyrights, pension payments, lorry drivers' licences, financial services, competition rules, chemicals, cosmetics, toys, electronics, consumer rights...

Galileo satnav. Euratom nuclear fuels and medical isotopes....

EU Social Fund. Regional development fund. Agricultural guarantee fund. Creative Europe arts and culture fund, Eurasmus university exchange. Science funding....

Now we know.
Maisiebabe
5th Apr 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Personally I just want out. I don't care if we leave with no deal, the whole reason that MPs are voting against everything is because they don't want Brexit to happen at all and they'll try anything to stop it, aided by that odious toad, John Bercow.

We voted, their job is to carry out the wishes of the people of this country and instead they are holding the people to ransom, so that they can have their way.

I simply can't put into words my utter disgust as they way MPs of all parties have behaved. They had 2 years to sort it and spent the time squabbling amongst themselves and now have the cheek to ask for an extension.

Parliament should be dissolved, in fact the Queen would do a much better job!
pip2
5th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Are you sure you understand what you are saying?

Will UK based pensions be able to pay pensions to people in EU countries, under your plan?
Yodama
3rd Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
IF YOU DOUBT A GRAND CONSPIRACY EXISTS?
A conspiracy the EU is actively perpetrating on this nation?
Quotes from those in the know!

BENJAMIN DISRAELI - FIRST BRITISH PRIME MINISTER 1844
"The world is governed by very different personages from what is imagined by those who are not behind the scenes."
In 1876:
"The governments of the present day have to deal not merely with other government, with emperors. Kings and ministers, but with the secret societies which have everywhere their unscrupulous agents. And can at the last moment, upset all the government's plans."

JAMES WARBURG, ROTHSCHILD BANKING AGENT- 1950:
"We shall have world government whether or not you like it...by conquest or consent."

PROFESSOR CARROL QUIGLEY 1966:
"The powers of financial capitalism had another far reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole."

DAVID ROCKEFELLER - TRILATERAL COMMISSION FOUNDER -1991
"We are grateful The Washington Post. The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years.

IT WOULD HAVE BEEN IMPOSSIBLE FOR US TO DEVELOP OUR PLAN FOR THE WORLD IF WE HAD BEEN SUBJECT TO THE BRIGHT LIGHTS OF PUBLICITY DURING THOSE YEARS. But the work is now much more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government.

The Supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto determination practiced in past centuries."

HENRY KISSINGER -1991
"Today, America would be outraged if UN troops entered Los Angeles to restore order.
Tomorrow, they will be grateful!
This would especially be true if they were told that there were an outside threat from beyond, whether real or promulgated that threatened our very existence.
It is then that all people of the world will plead to deliver them from this evil.
The one thing man fears is the unknown. When presented with this scenario, individual rights will be willingly relinquished for the guarantee of their well-being granted to them by a World Government,"


STROBE TALBOTT - U.S. DEPUTY SECRETARY OF STATE. - 1992
"In the next century, nations as we know it will be obsolete; all states will recognize a single global authority. National sovereignty wasn't such a great idea after all."

ARTHUR SCHLESINGER - U.S. HISTORIAN - 1995:
"We are not going to achieve a new world order without paying for it in blood as well as words and money."


Do we roll over and have our tummies tickled or fight back?
pip2
5th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
There is an EU - NATO relations committee in the European Parliament.

There is EU - UN partnership for things like helping stop diseases spreading.

The European External Action Service has a webpage about the EU - UN partnership.
Yodama
7th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
" Fee Fie Fo Fum, I smell the presence of fifth column."
pip2
11th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Yodama
3rd Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
A very modern BETRAYAL - yet another delay!

Who is controlling the new breakaway party who seem to be in thrall of the EU? The Independent's who are gearing up to run with the political remain agenda? Hoping to usurp the two inept Tory and Labour parties who are on the brink of collapse?

The one and only busy ( Mr Treason) Tony Blair, is orchestrating behind the scenes, he who sold his soul to the devil a long time ago.

TONY BLAIR PROMISED HIS ELECTORS IN 1983 IN SEDGEFIELD
"WE MUST NEGOTIATE A WITHDRAWAL FROM THE EEC WHICH HAS DRAINED OUR NATURAL RESOURCES AND DESTROYED JOBS."

So what happened to change his mind and to sell his country out? "If we make you famous, what will you do for us?" They (the cabal) know everyone has their price... Judas...

14 Jan 1999, Tony Blair was awarded the Charlemagne prize of Aachen ( worth 5,ooo deutschmarks) for services to " ACTIVE AND CONSTRUCTIVE" ROLE IN ERUOPEAN INTEGRATION.
He received the prize at a cathedral where holy Roman emperors were crowned.

Previous British winners
Churchill - who approached the French after WW11 to form a union.
Edward Heath - the traitor who lied to the British public to get us into the EEC.

The list of people who have been awarded this prize is mind boggling, all of them hell bent on a Suprastate of world domination.

We will be giving up everything, we may have figureheads in Parliament but the laws and statutes and our lives will be run from the EU.
BEHIND THE EU ARE THE PEOPLE WHO ARE REALLY RUNNING THINGS.
pip2
5th Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Tony Blair once wanted to be president of the European Council.

The top table of national leaders.

He did not get the job.

Donald Tusk has the job now and he is doing a good job.
Hyacynth
5th May 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I don't know much about the New World Order but I don't think that the EU is much help to them is it? Surely there's safety in numbers. How will the uk be safer from 'them' bobbing about all alone in the Atlantic?
viking
2nd Apr 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Please then explain your items 1+2+3 how they are not carried out in practice.
Starting two years ago the EEC decided to decrease the grants to GB, however the grants to Germany and France increased !!
Presumably it was difficult to argue against 27 other member states who love how the "system " works so well in their favour.
pip2
5th Apr 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Sources please.

Are you talking about the EU budget?

Is it in the EU budget financial report?

Which year?

When was it published in the Official Journal? Reference number please.
viking
1st Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
If it does transpire that this country returns to the EU, it will be inevitable that the "brains" in Brussels will think of some way of punishing UK for having the temerity to even think about leaving. There will be a price to pay [ not yet decided ] so as to discourage other Iberian countries from trying to wriggle free.
pip2
1st Apr 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The European Union is based on the principle of sincere co-operation.

Being a member means acting in good faith.

Discrimination against a fellow member country is illegal under EU law.

The European Commission is there to enforce this.

If the Commission can't solve the problem then the case goes to the Court of Justice of the EU.
pip2
31st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
"Many Brits do not realize to what extent Brexit has traumatised the five million people who were disenfranchised in the referendum and the 3.5 million EU27 citizens living in the UK have been particularly hard hit...

"The foreign press is getting more and more interested in this, because it is a cultural phenomenon that was entirely avoidable and that is utterly tragic and shameful to the UK".

Quote from Emmy van Deurzen.

About Nouvel Observateu magazine in France.

Meanwhile.... My stepson says his London employer has just had two contracts cancelled because of you-know-what.

Yes, he's signed the six-million petition.
Bluebird55
31st Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Every five years (sometimes less) we have a general election, and very often we will change our minds and elect a different government. Three years ago we voted to leave the EU and many people say we must not have another referendum. Are we no longer allowed to change our minds? I accept we can't have this referendum every three years - in today, out tomorrow - but three years ago we didn't know all the problems that Brexit would cause, and that the politicians would be unable to resolve it.

Are those who wish to leave afraid of losing? They shouldn't be, because if we vote leave again, we would be saying to the politicians, "Now get on and do what you should have done three years ago!" But if we vote remain, we are only doing what we should be allowed to do i.e. change our minds.
pip2
31st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Thank you for that...

My comment is who do you mean by "we"?

Young adults who were 16 in 2016 and can now vote?

Citizens of other EU countries who have loved this country for a long time? Who were denied a voice?

British abroad more than 15 years? Also denied a voice?

What about the people who could vote but did not? Perhaps for good reason? Do they now have a view?
ElisabethR
31st Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
So many words spoken so many written...parliament didnt know what to do so called a referendum....they were told...whether they liked it or not they now knew. They should have then worked together to bring it to fruition regardless of their personal opinion.
I am so sick of people saying but what about those who wanted to stay....do you think they would have said oh no we will have to have another go.
pip2
31st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Was Northern Ireland properly talked about in 2016?

The Good Friday Agreement? The customs union? The single market?

Free movement freedoms? Rights to live, work, study, retire in other EU countries? (Not a free-for-all, see Your Europe - residence rights).

Professional qualifications recognition? Consumer protections? Passenger rights? Safety standards for toys and electricals?

EU support for culture, science, wildlife, academia, security and justice cooperation...?

Chemicals, flights, train drivers' licences?

To name a few?
pip2
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
"The case-law of the Court of Justice of the EU is no longer limited to economic issues but covers ever more diverse areas in relation to the daily life of citizens...

"It has delivered numerous judgements which directly relate to then concerns of citizens. Examples including judements on the wearing of the Islamic headscarf at work, on the rights of air passengers, on the Uber Pop service, on immigration policy, on the proof of defectiveness of a vaccine."

Not my words. The words of Koen Lenaerts. President of the Court. In the 2017 annual report of the Court.

This is modern Europe.
Yodama
30th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Our Queen Elizabeth, beloved my millions at home and around the world.

Our MP's , Military forces, police forces and the people of this country - swear allegiance to the sovereign.

Since 1993, she is no longer a sovereign but a SUZERAIN, an independent body, subject to the duties imposed by the European Union.

The European Union then has de facto control of the peoples of this country and our sovereignty.

On the 9th September 1993 - the Maastricht Constitutional Treason charges were levied against Government Ministers for signing away our constitutional rights to a foreign power.
Hurd and Maud who went to Brussels to sign the treaty are guilty of Treason under British law. Under statutes in force, anyone who undermines the constitution of the Great Britain and its parliament and its law-making of its people ...is GUILTY OF TREASON.

The Magna Carta is changed and means nothing now, no more freedom's, our laws are now superseded by the Eu.

IN 1971 When Ted Heath signed the accession treaty to the EU, a letter from the Lord Chancellor Lord Kilmuir to Edward Heath, warned him that it would be the first time a British Parliament had ever undertaken such a removal of constitutional rights and laws.
The Kilmuir letter was shelved and covered up for nearly 30 years. It was in the 1990's that it was finally revealed.. too late, the deed was done.
A CONSTITUTIONAL OUTRAGE AND A TREASON!
TO ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES, ALL SUCCESSIVE PARLIAMENTS ARE ACTING TREASONABLY.

We have a tool at our disposal, Under the British Declaration of Independence, we can force our MP's by a simple act of Parliament to take back what was unlawfully and treasonably taken from us.
Although I am questioning our voting powers which are being ignored.

Lord Justice McGarry stated " Parliament is omnipotent in everything except in the removal of its omnipotence."

Remainers:
Should all sit around the EU campfire, hold hands and sing Kumbaya while wearing rose tinted spectacles.
Ignore this Brexit at your peril!
pip2
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Being a member of a bigger organisation comes with obligations as well as benefits.

You can say the same of every other thing the UK belongs to.

NATO membership means big obligations.

At least the EU has a Parliament where we can be elected to hold the powerful to account.

At least the EU has an Ombudsman where we can complain.

At least the EU has a Commission that acts equally for all.

At least the EU has Europe Direct enquiry service.

At least the EU has a Court where we can complain. The lower court is open to citizens and businesses. The upper court is for appeal.
pip2
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
The EU is full of British staff.

Sir Julian King. Head of European Commission from UK. His job, Security Union.

Sir Tim Barrow. Head of UK permanent representation.

British ministers and permanent representatives go to EU meetings at the Council of the EU.

73 UK Members of the European Parliament. Welsh, English, Scottish, Northern Irish members.

Phil Wynn-Owen. Chief auditor from UK at European Court of Auditors.

Eleanor Sharpston QC. Chief advocate from UK at the Court of Justice of the EU.

Theresa May. Prime minister, goes to European Council meetings.
pip2
31st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
That's right, give me a minus.

For saying that the EU is a local organisation run by this country and our nearest allies, friends and neighbours.

Did you know there is EU - UN partnership?

Did you know EU negotiators help represent this country at the WTO?

Did you know that the North West Atlantic Fisheries Organisation includes US, Canada and EU as members?
ElisabethR
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Oh dear....where to now? Looks as if simply OUT is the default position now unless something can be cobbled together? We are pretty well prepared for it. Don't think you have it right Pip re all the scientific conferences. Whichever science it is is medicine,environmental etc and whoever is offering financial backing you would not be able to banned anyone from anywhere attending. Firstly it would go against EU policy and secondly and more importantly the science fraternity would not allow it. As for all the trading standards....hello? They are on our stature books and therefore part of the law...not so easy to change.
No deal would be a muddle for a few weeks and then would settle. We are in a good state financially. So many countries in the EU are really struggling. France is just about bankrupt as is Italy,Spain,Portugal and who else? Germany,who put in the most money,is really struggling and a footstep away from recession.....
Like thousands of people I really believed that as all the parties had PROMISED in their manifestos that they would work together to get the best deal for us that was what they would actually do! I'm old enough to have known better.
pip2
30th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Er, a "muddle" is not what Sir Ivan Rogers said to the Treasury Select Committee.

Please name the ways in which "we are pretty well prepared for it"?

That's not what the Irish papers are saying.

Why has 10% of all the overseas capital in the city of London fled?

There are problems across Europe of course.

Which is why sticking together is the right thing to do.
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Have you heard of the not-for-profit books

In Limbo

and

In Limbo Too

compiled by Elena Remigi?

The personal testimonies of citizens of other EU countries in the UK. And British in Europe.
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I'm sorry to hear it.

But did you know that there is an EU-Canada trade agreement?

It's called CETA.

But more important is our shared values. Being in EU means showing support for democracy, solidarity, equality and the rule of law.

And security too. Sticking together to cope with the problems that affect us all. Russia. China. America. Human trafficking. Fake medicines. Illegal fishing. Illegal ivory. Terrorism. Climate. Crimea, Sevastopol....

As Vidar Helgesen, Norway's Europe minister, has said. You can find his article "A Norweigian View" in Open Democracy.
DerekJ9
29th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Today March 29th 2019. Democracy died in Great Britain.
pip2
29th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Sorry you think that... But we say democracy's working.

Would you like to come and meet us at Pulse of Europe in High Wycombe? First and third Sunday, 2 pm, Church St.

About the achievements, successes and benefits of the European Union.

For instance... Today my wife said she's worried about the Asian hornet. Invasive species. Been seen in France. Comes from Asia. Eats honeybees!

There's an international conference in Italy at the moment for bee experts. One of the subjects is what to do to stop the Asian hornet.

Who is helping to run the conference? The EU. The EU environment fund is helping. It's called the LIFE programme.

Because invasive species are a cross-border issue that affects environment.
Yodama
12th Apr 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Yes democracy died Derek.
Britain a democracy taking orders from a EU Bureaucracy...shameful!

You can't say democracy and bureaucracy in the same breath.

Attached below is what we have now become.

From: Academia by Juan Fernando Milne A01374438Sociology

Relationship between Democracy and Bureaucracy
First of all is important to define what democracy is and what bureaucracy is:
Democracy
is a form of government made by the people or their elected representatives.
Bureaucracy
is a form of government made up of officials and administrators working for the government.
The term "bureaucracy" is French in origin, and combines the French word bureau – desk or office – with the Greek word kratos – RULE OR POLITICAL POWER.

My emphasis on rule or political power.
Lionel
28th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Velvet Revolution as in Czech 1989? Did the job!
Lionel
28th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The heart of Hereford the Wake lives on. (OK, he was a Saxon)

That Saxon is alive and well in my neck of the woods too!
Lionel
28th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Your choice...

In our house we look for the EU leaf logo for organic standard.

We look for the EU Protected Designation of Origin logo.

Did you know there are loads of UK products that also benefit from the PDO scheme?

Did you know British writers and designers benefit from EU rules on copyrights and designs? EU intellectual property office.

Did you know EU rules help prevent farm diseases spreading? One of them is a disease of olives that could hit English oak trees.

Did you know that potatoes grown in UK to make crisps are often a variety of potato that has been bred by a company in Netherlands?

Potato disease is a problem all over northern Europe. There's been a conference about it in Scotland.

Stopping South American potato disease getting to Europe. There's EU rules about that.

Farmers rely on EU single farm payment. Did you know you can look up who gets EU farm funding in your area? Cap-payments.defra.gov.uk.

I looked it up in my area and found Burnham Beeches nature reserve gets help.

All this agreed by government ministers at EU meetings. Usually, MEPs in the European Parliament as well.
pip2
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I didn't know the UK was a one party communist country.
John Walsh
27th Mar 2019
-4
Thanks for voting!
Please write your comments here...I have Poles as neighbours and I absolutely despise them.
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
What's wrong with your neighbours? Sorry to hear it.

I have friends from fellow EU countries.

And friends in other EU countries.
ElisabethR
27th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Will be interesting to see what today brings. Its either agree to something or just leave. So can 'I know how to do it' corbyn now reveal his mighty answer and sail us gently out? Ha ha. All those who think they have the only way will be forced to put their money where their mouts are.....and in the end it will come down to walk out with no deal or Theresa's deat. N.Ireland are the ones in the middle but maybe the backstop should be thrown back at Europe.....Ireland also want a free boarder there. So what happens with the Swiss boarders? Not a lot. And no matter how this ends remember it will all be the same in a million years.
pip2
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
You seem to forget that because of Northern Ireland that's not legally an option.
Felix1
26th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
One way or another we have always been part of Europe. What has changed?
ElisabethR
27th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
And we always will be....just not part of the dictators. Friends in France (bankrupt) Italy...ditto...and germany...on brink of recession. Spain and portugal think its only a wait and watch for who goes next. I think France will stay...they will want the financial back up. We are the 5th biggest country financially so what is all the screaming about. All makes for interesting politics.
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Everything agreed at EU meetings is agreed democratically.

What's wrong with that?

For most things, both Houses have to agree.

1) The Council of the European Union. The 28 national governments.

2) The European Parliament. Directly elected. Every vote counts. I support Catherine Bearder MEP.
Yodama
26th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I am so very tired of gnawing on this dried -up bone of contention.
There is no meat left on it!

Tired of fighting this war of words that I know falls on the deaf ears of the people we are supposed to trust..
Tired of this war of words that divides our people and a proud nation.

The end game has already been planned and is being executed.behind a curtain of pretence.. A pretence so devious so as to lull us into thinking that we have power as a people to change anything at all.
David Cameron simply handed the Baton of Superstate to Theresa May who is running with the plan to the finish line.

So, so tired but I will fight on till my last gasp!
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Sorry to see you think that...

But the EU is not and cannot be a state.

It only does the things that national leaders and their parliaments have decided to allow.

Only things that are cross-border. Or can only be best done together.

If a proposal goes beyond what is allowed then national parliaments can object. It's called the yellow and orange card procedure.

Source: How the EU works, EU Publications Office.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I'm afraid this country has done it to itself.

The EU has done a better job of looking after us.

See the European Parliament's published impact studies, for a start.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
How many of those voted to protest and didn't expect to win?

How many voted for a joke?

How many didn't vote?

How many couldn't vote, and say that was unfair?

How many have now changed their mind?
Lionel
25th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
None of the above is of any relevance whatsoever. The result stands.
Nannyskenn
25th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Some 75 years ago thousands of our young men and women lost their lives defending Europeans. The Brits voted to leave , our politions have ignored that vote. Rightly or wrongly, this fantastic nation has made up their minds and our politions have let them down.

It is the polititions who are in the wrong they are not doing the job that they get paid for, All of them, irrigardless of the Party they support.
Yodama
26th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I wish you would enlighten me, do you have the statistics on hand?
A bit of a stab in the dark wouldn't you say?
Yodama
26th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
My question was for pip2
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Time to accept that the argument goes on.
viking
25th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Please check on Mogg's directorships and shareholdings..............hmm
Lionel
25th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
And his voting record in the HoC.
Yodama
26th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Trojan horses abound.
Lionel
26th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Bring on the empty horses.
Yodama
27th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
David Niven book wasn't it Lionel?
Lionel
27th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Yes, companion a book to The Moon's a Balloon. Both good reads from an indifferent actor.

What about this latest twist in the shambles of Brexit? Many leading lights turning their backs on 17.4 million voters? Careers blighted never to be seen or heard of again.
Yodama
27th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I did read The Moon's a Balloon, very entertaining but not my cup of tea.

Nothing surprises me about the Brexit debacle, as I have always said, nothing will be allowed to get in the way of the "big plan." We the people are an irrelevancy and a nuisance, just there to milked to keep the greedy cabals in the luxury they are accustomed to.


There is a saying " remember how you treat people on the way up, you may need them on the way down."
Those guilty of this betrayal and treason, I have their names etched in my memory.
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Some of those voted to protest and actually support EU.

I met someone who said he did exactly that it High Wycombe town centre.

Says he works with EU legislation all the time and said it is "sound".

My name is Phil Jones. What's yours and where are you, Lionel?
Mozy
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I love Mogg and trust what he says ,but not on taking a bad deal we should walk away no deal and get on with saving Britain. We need to get on protecting our borders we are a small island with too many people
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
EU membership helps with border control.

May said so before the referendum.

Things like the Schengen Information System. Europol. European criminal records information sharing system.

Free movement is not a free for all. See Your Europe - residence rights on europa.eu.
kentrix39
24th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
This mess all came about about because someone (who was obviously financed very much to a very large extent by forces opposed to leaving Europe) took our government to the High court and won an injunction making it mandatory that the House of Prats had a say in the leaving process. If it had not beden for the intervention of this person we would have been sorted out long ago. The will of the people in a democracy is paramount and if any MP cannot see that they should immediately resign.
We have always been a nation of adventurers and world traders for hundreds of years of course those under fifty do not know that as they have never experienced a free country and they are afraid of leaving home. Just as the greedy parasites that return home to leech off their parents they seem to think the EU is good to them we only get back some of the money that we pay them, we are lucky that they do not lose all of it over the course of the audit period there are billions that they cannot account for.
This has to be done with or without a deal May has a mandate from the people, let her get on with it ASAP. We do not want to have to elect (I will not) another bunch of blood sucking MEPs when we are just about to get rid of one lot for ever.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The accounts of the EU have been 'signed off' every year since 2007.

The European Court of Auditors has published its report every year since 1977.

Have you read the 1977 report? I have.

The Court of Auditors audits all the things that get EU funding. The report on the EU Natura 2000 wildlife programme is online.

The Court works with national audit bodies in member countries.

Know of improper conduct? Tell the European Ombudsman.

Questions about EU? Ask Europe Direct.
Irene88
26th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
signed off and being accurate are two different things.
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Have you looked at the reports of the European Court of Auditors? Published. Online.

Gina Miller is a transparency campaigner.

I supported the People's Challenge to Article 50.
AnnieV5
24th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
We’d be better off leaving with No deal under WTO RULES than anything May can cobble together!
pip2
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Does WTO cover flights? No.

Chemicals? No.

Financial services? Not all.

Medicines? Only partly.

When was the last successful WTO round? Not since the 1990s.

Have you listened to Sir Ivan Rogers?

Former chief permanent representative to EU.
Lionel
24th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
A well written, concise account of how we got into this mess.

But where do we go from here?
Lardbucket80
24th Mar 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
When we voted to leave nothing was said about any deals we must leave without any deals treacherous politicians are walking all over us they need to be tought a lesson they will never forget.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Please don't include me in your "we'.

Thank you.
GraniGoggins45
23rd Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
A bad deal is worse than staying in ! The people vited to come out of Europe not stay in ; Leave with no deal and then negotiate which is what should have happened in the first place instead of All the uncertanty fir everyone Disgraceful!
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Which people? At the rally in London on Saturday I met a British man who lives in Romania.
xmasdaybaby1966
23rd Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
We need foreign workers to keep our beloved NHS going. You don't see too many nurses from the EU but plenty from places such as India and The Philippines but, despite contributing to our system, they are forced to go home after 5 years because of the difficult visa requirements to remain here. It is ridiculous that non-skilled EU citizens can stay here indefinitely while people from further afield have to leave only for hospitals having to go back to Mumbai and Manila to replace them. The right to remain here should be equally difficult for all non-UK citizens. Fair play please. We are British.
iluvtea
23rd Mar 2019
-4
Thanks for voting!
The EU is not perfect - but it is far better than the alternative. Lets stay in, become active members - it's not them and us, it's our future together. there is no scenario that makes the UK better outside of Europe, even the Brexiteers agree with this. Stop listening to extremely rich right wingers who are only trying to line their pockets even more.
PS
And I don't want American rat hairs in my produce!
USA allows up a small portion of vermin hair in food products - the EU allows none
viking
23rd Mar 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
Sorry but I think you may have been absent, staying within the EU does not mean that we would be able to change their ways. It has been tried many times in recent years .....- David Cameron the last was given a flea in his ear and sent packing for having the temerity to suggest the EU might possibly change their ways. After all if the members of the EEC are enjoying being on the gravy train, why should they change their ways to accomodate the silly English.

Most of the displaced East Coast fishermen to my knowledge are not " extremely rich right wingers trying to line their pockets". If you don't believe the effect of the disasterous policies of the EU, would you like to see and talk to the fisherfolk who had to sell their boats and are now on the scrap heap?

We now know who started the fake news about American food products.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Thank you. Lord Heseltine's speech about the peace in Europe, at the rally on Saturday 23rd, was wonderful.

Two wars. Never again.
Yodama
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Two wars never again....huh?

Michael Heseltine's rhetoric that moved so many remainiacs so deeply, a speech touting peace in Europe?

Well you can't make it up can you?
The old saying " Don't s**t on your own doorstep" rings so very true.

Simplistic to think there has been no conflict directly or indirectly attributed to the EU's peaceful aims.
That they won the Nobel prize is a farce. They were impotent when action was needed to resolve conflicts such as the Balkans, Palestine/Israel conflict, Yugoslavia and the Russian annexation of Crimea
External conflicts are not mentioned loudly in the halls of the EU parliament.

European External Action Service, we don't hear much about - the EU service for wars fought under the guise of maintaining peace...Or is it for economics and possession?

Where have our troops been fighting and dying while we have been living in the PEACEFUL EU?

Iraq
Blair's Weapons of mass destruction war based on LIES.
Bombing of Libya
Bombing and war in Syria
Targeting Isis
Little conflicts in other countries don't even make the headlines.

Tell the wives and children of those who have not returned home or have returned home maimed.
Yes...peace in Europe.....at the cost of what and whom?
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Defence is a job for each country.

There is a European Parliament committee for EU-NATO relations.

The reaction of other European countries to the Balkans war was shameful. Not enough. You're right about that.

How is Tony Blair in Iraq the fault of anyone in Brussels, Strasbourg, or Luxembourg?

"The 2012 Nobel Peace Prize was awarded to the European Union (EU) 'for over six decades [having] contributed to the advancement of peace and reconciliation, democracy and human rights in Europe'".
pip2
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
It's not called EEC anymore.

Changed its name in 1986.

You're out of date on fish. Example:

Fishing industry body Seafish says that North Sea cod was at its lowest ever in 2006. But it has recovered since, thanks to EU efforts. ("The story of North Sea Cod", 3 August 2017, seafish.org).

Did you see my letter in Metro newspaper?
DaveJ06
22nd Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
If we remain I suspect that there will be repercussions and we will be made to pay/suffer in the long run. Do we want to take that chance.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I have more trust in the European Commission than in our own government.
Irene88
26th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
You really don't understand how the EU works do you!

MEP's are elected.

Council of ministers are heads of State.

Commission are appointed by their mates - not elected. Paid massive amounts of money, plus expenses plus 2 pensions and accountable to no-one.
e.g. Kinnock, Patten, Mandelson, appointed to Commisssion.

Kinnock lost UK election so has MP pension and EU pension and is now a Lord not bad for "a loser"
Mandelson resinged from Labour party under a cloud. Also EU pension and MP pension.
Patten was given the job when Hong Kong went back to Chinese Also a lord ans multi pension holder.
pip2
29th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
No, heads of states or governments meet at leat four times a year at the European Council.

Council of Ministers aka 'Council of the EU' is for government ministers and professional diplomats.

Appointments to the European Commission is done with European Council, European Parliament and national governments in a process with several steps.

Commission people have to face a panel of MEPs before they take their jobs. Confirmation hearings.
Nannyskenn
22nd Mar 2019
9
Thanks for voting!
I think that all politicians should have all their pay stopped until they can behave themselves. They are supposed to support the voters in their constituencies, they are all trying to move themselves forward in their parties, they have messed about for the last two years., and have completely ignored the will of the people. WE HELD A REFERENDUM IN 2016 WE THE PEOPLE VOTED TO LEAVE why can’t or won’t they carry out our wishes.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Well I quite like the EU and it would be nice to stay please thank you.
Not2grey
22nd Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Parliament agrees to ask the People and agree to abide by the result . When they don't get the result they expect they do everything in their power to thwart Brexit . Some Politicians are treating their constituents with utter contempt . Those Politicians where their constituents have voted to leave should support that view or resign and let someone who will respect democracy stand. They have got so used to just rubber stamping what the European Commissiin say that they seem utterly unable to think for themselves they are like lemmings.If you are a believer in Democracy then we should leave on March 29th .
When I next cast my vote I will ensure that I find out which way the candidate have voted on Brexit , hopefully there may be some more Independent cadidates fielded as I cannot in all concience vote for any of the bunch in Parliament niw .
Rummo
22nd Mar 2019
7
Thanks for voting!
For me, it was never about immigration or foreigners, ( I have polish and Italian in-laws in the family) but about resources, Integration and sovereignty.
Who would have thought that our elected officials would sign away the right to govern ourselves, or the ability for the UK electorate to vote in, or remove the EU governing body (the MEP’s are pretty much powerless). No wonder punishment for treason was removed from the statute book!
Out, OUt, OUT. With and for Europe, NOT of Europe.
Yodama
22nd Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Well - exactly!!
It is all about being a powerless country run by a superstate parliament of foreigners whose names I can't pronounce.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
In Maidenhead high street while flying a Euro flag...

I met a German woman who said she cannot understand attitudes like that. "UK has been so influential in EU!" she said.

Look at the EU's democratic voting process.

The UK has 73 of 751 MEPs. Richard Corbett, Molly Scott-Cato, Catherine Bearder, Keith Taylor... all excellent, to name a few.

Manfed Weber, Guy Verhofstadt, Phillippe Lamberts, Elmar Brok, Sophia in t' Veld... I admire them.
Nannyskenn
25th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
You can always move to the Continentif you are so enthused with it
pip2
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
The European Parliament has lots of powers.

It can sack the entire Commission with a two-thirds majority.

It amends and accepts and rejects proposals.

It has equal powers with government ministers in most areas.

It accepts or rejects the budget.

It holds all the other EU institutions to account.

It debates things like human rights and democratic freedoms around the world.

Other EU countries use their MEPs better.

Source: The European Parliament - The Citizens' Voice in the EU. From EU Publications Office,
Bichon100
22nd Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
We voted to leave As parliament cannot come up with a good deal we should leave without one
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
What's your answer to the Irish border?

Will lorry drivers' licences be valid, under your plan?
rjc1944
22nd Mar 2019
8
Thanks for voting!
"No Deal" should have been our default position. With that in place our negotiations for a deal would have been from a position of strength rather than the appallingly weak hand that our PM has been forced to hold. MPs should never have been granted such a level of veto over the process. We voted to leave and that should have happened long since. If we had to accept the Article 50 delay until the 29th of March then OK - leave on that date with or without a deal. The EU has more to lose than we do - Germany in particular won't want to see tariffs on its exports to us. We are huge net contributors to the EU's budget and so they naturally don't want us to go. We could have been leading the negotiations with the strongest hand and yet have allowed our establishment lackeys, self-interested media and opportunistic Labour party to water down all of our chances. Shame on our Parliament, they've sold us down the river.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
I'm afraid it is the other way around.

We should be supporting our neighbours.

To deal with Russia. China. America. Human trafficking. Terrorism. Environment. Corporate tax avoidance. Illegal fishing. Illegal timber. Fake medicines....

All these things that can only be best tackled together.
LetitiaD
22nd Mar 2019
8
Thanks for voting!
No Deal is better than a Bad Deal! It is legal for us to leave the EU with No Deal and we should do it!
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
You forget that's not legally an option? See article in the Guardian.
Lionel
25th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
rjc1944
26th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Who would believe anything written in that left-wing rag written for civil servants and other government-funded establishment?
Irene88
26th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
SeeAct ofParliament written into British Law because of Gina Miller Court case.
pip2
30th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Have you read the Good Friday Agreement?

Please explain the EU customs union, and internal market, and how those relate to the GFA.

What about the EU 'programme for peace and reconciliation in Northern Ireland and the border region'?

Did you come to the Irish Border Communities' protest?
RowdyRona
22nd Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Too many people involved now - I’d love to know how many foreigners are voting to remain - its no longer “The will of the British people” ! I don’t have a problem with immigration but you can’t expect people from foreign lands to join in and immediately understand how UK politics works - many of them can’t even speak English yet are entitled to vote!
Alicia
22nd Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Remember that many of these 'foreigners', as you call them, were actually born here !!!
RowdyRona
22nd Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
And will be heavily influenced by their parents who probably weren’t!
andrew1959
21st Mar 2019
-5
Thanks for voting!
Lionel
21st Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Apparently many signatures are from North Korea. Makes a mockery of that petition, don't you think?
Mary Lincoln
22nd Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
We the majority of the British people voted LEAVE and that is what we expect our government to do.
Yodama
22nd Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Oh you mean the petition that is infested with "bots"...desperate measures methinks.
andrew1959
22nd Mar 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Hi Lionel. Looks like they've put a stop to those pesky fake signatures from North Korea (if they ever existed, of course)! https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/22/petition-to-revoke-article-50-hits-3-million-signatures
andrew1959
22nd Mar 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Well, get a move on then. But when your time has run out, it'll be our turn!
Lionel
22nd Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Be careful, personal insults are not tolerated here.
andrew1959
22nd Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
No insult, same answer.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
How many? Evidence please.

What about the actual lawbreaking in the referendum campaigns?

There were three campaigns. One was incompetent. The one I supported. I was clueless about EU in 2016.

The others broke the law.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
It would be great if the prime minister and all her ministers did resign, yes please.

63% of those who voted, wanted to stay or didn't vote.

Lots more people around than that.

What's the opinion now?
Lionel
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
It is votes that count.
Retiredyorkie
21st Mar 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
I totally agree with MrsPat 5 hrs ago how can a bad deal be a good deal.

It is time that the politicians stopped arguing amongst themselves and do what is best of Great Britain - think it has now got to a point where everyone is sick and tired of the arguments between the politicians and gave the voters ALL the details of the deal and not just what they want us to know.
Lionel
21st Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Nothing, not anything, founded on a lie will prosper and be fruitful.
MrsPat
21st Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
How can a bad deal be good?
pip2
20th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
The Lisbon Treaty was signed in 2007 by Gordon Brown and David Miliband.

It came into effect in 2009.

Please ignore the fictional post by "Lionel" below. It is 100% nonsense.
seebee64
20th Mar 2019
7
Thanks for voting!
You have obviously missed that he is stating the effect of the treaty. Brown, Major and Heath are traitors to UK democracy having gave the governance of the UK to foreign powers without the consent of the people. I suggest you look at the definition of democracy in the dictionary!
MrsPat
21st Mar 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
That is a bit rude-fictional nonsense indeed.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
What he has written about Lisbon is simply made up. Even the dates are wrong.

Ok here you are. Oxford concise dictionary:

democracy n. (State having) government by all the people, direct or representative; form of society ignoring hereditary class distinctions and tolerating minority views.

Ours is a representative democracy.
Lionel
20th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
What bothers me most is the implementation of the Lisbon Treaty in 2020, a treaty which, by the fact it materially changed Britain's status, was passed into law by Gordon Brown.

Here's a few main points:

1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed.

2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s.

3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty.

4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.

5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK.

(Posted below in reply to pip 2 but he hasn't had the courtesy to reply!

Is that what we voted out for? Is that what we want for ourselves and our kids? ~Nothing more than a parish outside Berlin?

Not me!
Wilf
20th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Lionel I must say this is the first time I have heard of some of these points. All EU states must accept the Euro by 2022. What including the UK? I have not seen one iota of that in the UK media?
Lionel
20th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Wilf, some years ago I read a summary of the treaty and took notes. It's all there. Also I read non UK press several times a week. At the time of Lisbon American journalists couldn't believe Brown had signed it so nonchalantly.

Why wasn't it in our press? I don't know for fact, but I do know for certain an awful lot of British news is not reported to us. One needs the foreign press to inform us. Besides which, at the time of Lisbon and ever since the EU has been such a divisive issue much is just slipped under the carpet, done on the nod and wink, so to speak.
pip2
20th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
The post by "Lionel" has been copied from a fake email that has been circulated.
pip2
20th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Because it is totally untrue, every word of it.
Wilf
20th Mar 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
Thanks Lionel but it seems strange as its not even on the Wikipedia of Lisbon 2020 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Lisbon I think its more fake news put out there to scare us all!
Lionel
20th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
If that is the case Wilf it's been around a very long time and was not picked up by American reporters at the time. I don't recall seeing a retraction.

If what you say is true, then the summary document which I have on CD somewhere must also be a fake.

Thanks for pointing that out.
seebee64
21st Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Sorry people it is true it is what the Lisbon treaty will require all EU countries to comply with.
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Sorry Seebee I have read that this is fake news about all countries adopting the Euro-rubbish
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Very welcome Lionel-I think people like you are I are sensible Brits. there does seem to be a lot of rubbish being propagated by both sides. AS I have said a lot of times we need a leader in this country-its a great pity for us all.
Lionel
21st Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Its my understanding we'll be having a new leader soon. The question is not who but of what calibre statesman are they?
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Yes I agree Lionel. Mrs May blamed everyone but herself last night. She is hopeless! She is leading Brexit and has made a total pigs ear of it. All that rubbish about "Brexit is Brexit" squarking like a parrot! Well sorry Mrs May you are our dear leader-the buck stops with you not Parliament
Lionel
21st Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Wilf, I found the CD and have checked the authorship of that Lisbon summary. It appears nowhere on the net. You are quite correct, that entire document is a fake for which I must apologise to you, and all readers, for quoting it.

The question of leadership for our country is difficult indeed. Perhaps we're at a 1945 moment: the old guard are not suited to lead this nation into the choppy waters of post Brexit. Then Churchill was rejected and perhaps the only honourable Socialist prime minister we've had, Attlee, was voted in on a platform of change. Hence we got such edifices as the NHS etc.

There was an old saying in Norfolk farming. The further down the muck heap you dig the more rotten it is. I wouldn't hesitate to apply this to our current political scene. Thus, just maybe we will prosper under an entirely new management. I just don't know who that might be. Any ideas?
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Great comments Lionel-Yes you would need to dig down a long way in the muck heap with this lot. I really do not know. There is not one shining star among any of them. What a fiasco-65 million people and we cannot find a leader? But you are right we do need a new beginning. The Independent party may be a starter. Whoever it is needs to say what they think. Trump is a clump but at least he says what he thinks a bit like Thatcher. Not just gobbblegook and never answering any question put to them. We just need a few honest men and women who will have some vision and get Blighty back on its feet again.
Lionel
21st Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
I can only quote Cromwell once again: “You have been sat to long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!.”
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Great speech Lionel. Who was Cromwell talking to?
Lionel
21st Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
The Long Parliament, 1653
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Thanks Lionel I will look up online
Irene88
26th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Lionel is correct.
Irene88
26th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
CarolF34
20th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
The vote was to leave or remain. It said no where vote to leave with a deal! I don’t understand why the decision to leave is still being dictated by the EU. If we’re leaving then just get on with it and leave with no deal. The EU are purposely making it hard and our government are ignoring the democratic vote. A vote was taken and to leave was the outcome, whether you agree or not, but that’s how democracy works...well so I believed!
Shirleycranswick
20th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I totally agree with you CarolF34.
edintigertony
20th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Far better to remain and be able to influence from within EU rather than this bad deal which will give us no say
seebee64
20th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
You are undemocratic then?
shielward
19th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Yes, people voted to come out of the EU but the Prime Ministers agreement does not get us out of the EU but stuck in until we can find other ways of dealing with the N. Ireland border. 2 years, 5 years, 10 years who knows. In this case a bad deal is worse than no deal.
HilaryB58
19th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
I am currently trying to sort out care for a 90 year old relative - the law says that I cannot go against their wishes even if I believe they are making bad choices. BUT it looks to me as if our parliament is working to different rules. a majority in the country voted to come out of the EU but because our elected members don't agree with our decision they are doing whatever they can to overturn our 'bad choices' where is the fairness in that! we voted to come out and that is what we should have done, months ago.
seebee64
19th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
The question you should be asking, is a no deal better than a bad deal. The EU question has been answered. We voted to leave, if we don't you can kiss Democracy goodbye. Another good question would be if Parliament stops Brexit, What idiot will vote in an undemocratic country?
ChrisW34
20th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
We kissed democracy goodbye the day that bent referendum too place.
Bee13
19th Mar 2019
8
Thanks for voting!
We should just leave as stated in law. We are a resilient nation we would survive. Just leave and negotiate later that way we are in charge not being told by eu what we can and can't do
Shirleycranswick
20th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
What law is that because the Act of Parliament that made the referendum said nothing at all about what to do with the result.

And the Act of Parliament that gave May the power to give notice under article 50... did not say she had to.

Has Parliament ever actually voted on whether or not to be in the EU since June 2016? It has not.
Boardman
19th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
I would just like all politicians to recognise that when they ask the public to vote for a candidate or a policy, that in a democracy that vote is underpinned by centuries of law and must be honoured. Or do none of our politicians know what that means?
seebee64
20th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Totally agree the people are democratic, sad to say Parliament is not look at the second chamber unelected gravy train for the undemocratic!
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
I'm afraid you're mistaken, Boardman.

Voting for a candidate is under the rules of the Representation of the People Act 1983, amended 1985.

Check that on Google and you will find that both dates I have given are correct.

What you are saying is simply impossible. It is the Queen-in-Parliament that makes law.

The referendum had "considerable political significance" as Lord Pannick said in the Supreme Court. I went to the Supreme Court to hear the Miller case.

But it had no legal status so what you are saying is not possible.
Shirleycranswick
19th Mar 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
I had a conversation with a friend last week who was born in 1980 and is very intelligent a studied English at University. The only reason I make this point is that people of her age and younger know nothing about how we lived before we joined the EU. She was very concerned that we can't come away with no deal. That large companies like Nissan are already preparing to move their production out of the country etc etc. I told her I was born just after WW2. We as a country had NOTHING but the British spirit that we are famous for. We survived. My brother and I still had ration books in 1955 but we kept on going. People in this country has got too fat and lazy on benefit hangouts that they haven't paid into so hopefully if we leave with no deal or a bad deal we can rebuild our country to the great one it has been before and weed out the shirkers and illegal immigrants and they will have to work or find another country that will take care of them. Maybe we can get our steelworks back and other big businesses like that. We will still do trade with other countries as we always have before the EU. I don't think the younger generation know enough about our history and think we will disintegrate without a deal. WE WON'T. It will be hard for a while but we will battle through. It's what true Brits do!!!!
Wilf
19th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
I don't think we will get steelworks etc back when we produce 11 million tons per annum at our peak and the Chinese are producing 1 billion tons per year. the world has moved on a lot. Also I think we have changed a lot since the 70s when there were strikes galore etc and in most places there is now a real work ethic although our productivity per person is not as great as countries like the USA and Germany.
ElaineF21
19th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
On the contrary, true Brits campaign to keep our promises and support our neighbours and stay in the EU.

You seem to forget that because of the Good Friday Agreement what you are saying is not legally an option.

This Saturday I am going to the big march in London where I am meeting people from the 3million campaign.

The group for citizens of other EU countries who have lived and loved this country.

And British in Europe. The campaign for British in all the other EU countries.

I have a friend who is married to a Dutch woman and they live together in Sweden.
Yodama
19th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
The "Poppadum Plot" hatched up between John Bercow and Ken Clarke in a curry house, both ardent remainer;s.
It must have taken them some time to dig up that obscure 400 year old law that Bercow used to throw a spanner in May's works.

The speaker is supposed to be politically unbiased, it appears that rule has been broken. Baroness Boothroyd (past speaker,) has accused him of acting dishonestly.
Teflon Bercow must go.

Lot's of secret little meetings and plots going on in the halls of power, has anyone listened to the Kit-Kat secret tapes?
Or has anyone read the secret document Fco 30/104 which was buried for 30 years and has now come to light? If the public knew of the true intentions of Heath in joining the EEC they would have been furious and demanded his head on a platter. It is not too late to revoke it!

Britain is secretly planning to pour money and troops into the EU army anyway, doesn't matter how you vote.

All lies and more damned lies. We the people are just a tax paying irritation that must be scratched now and then.
Politicians have their orders, they must obey their Brussels bosses.

They are just a front to dupe the masses into thinking that their votes or needs actually matter.

Stop taking the blue pill, try the red one for a change.
I see a huge glitch in the Matrix.
pip2
20th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Permanent Structured Cooperation? That's the name of defence cooperation of EU countries.

It's voluntary. National sovereignty is not affected.
LizG233
19th Mar 2019
7
Thanks for voting!
When we voted to be in Europe that is when we were lied to.The prime minister then Edward Heath knew that we would be governed by the European Union.This was kept from voters deliberately because they knew we would not have voted for that.People died for us to have the freedom of choice in this country.Most of us do not want to be ruled by Brussels!!!! We want our own laws again and freedom to trade with the world,EU dictates who we are allowed to trade with that is not what we joined for or so we were told. We voted leave if the majority had been stay we would have had to accept it.Why can’t the remainers accept the democratic vote.
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
The EU is a shared organisation.

The only things that are done at the EU are the things that national leaders have agreed to do together.

Approved by every national parliament.

Like shared rules on citizens' rights. On farm animal welfare. On standards for toys. Lots of things like that.

The European Commission makes proposals. But only in the areas covered by the agreements, It is the national governments - and elected citizens - that pass the proposals.
Irene88
26th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Yes I remember that, We were told it was a common market to make trade easier. The rest of it was kept hidden by both Con and Lab parties since then.
Poppy1112
19th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
The vote to leave was NOT ADVISERY it is written in EU and British law. It cannot be revoked without a long and drawn out process. Please Remainers get that through your heads.. The vote last week to take no deal off the table was advisery as it is not bound by law.

So for all those who think no deal is off the table, it isn’t... it still stands and if the PM doesn’t get an extension from the EU which all 27 members have to approve and her third attempt albeit the deal has to have significant changes to be put to Parliament again gets voted off we will go out next Friday with No deal.. That is my understanding of it..
pip2
20th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
What a pity you're wrong...

Because if it were, it would say so in the Act of Parliament that made the referendum.

Which section number of the Act do you mean? You can't say and you won't find one, sorry.
Poppy1112
19th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
That’s not what he said on TV last week. He said we will be leaving on March 29th as if TM’s deal was voted down again the default is no deal and that’s what we will go out with. And don’t tell me no deal was voted off the table because as he said, “that wasn’t a binding vote when the MP’s voted to take it off the table”. If the EU 27 members don’t all vote for an extension they won’t grant it and on March 29th we will go out with a no deal....
Billythequiche
19th Mar 2019
8
Thanks for voting!
Why are people so blind? The situation has gone far beyond "in or out of Brexit". The least of it is the way the EU has treated us in the last 18 months, how can we stay with a sinking ship and have to bail out Greece again and then probably Italy? They covert the success we have made of recovering from recession and now want us to share our hard won gains with them.
The more serious issue is the attempt to destroy our democracy. The attempt by some MPs to rest control of the Brexit process was a COUP, yes a COUP. Such things in the recent past would have been classed as treason. The referendum must not be ignored, that was a "peoples vote". The question was simple, in or out. You cannot keep rerunning it until you get the result you want, imagine rerunning general elections that way?
On one side we have a Marxist/extremist controlled Labour Party whose sole aim is to have a general election and put Corbyn and Abbott in power, doesn't bear thinking about. The Conservative Party is being torn apart bay remainers, would be prime ministers and incompetents whose one chance for self publicity is to be amongst chaos. Cable and co. are pathetic and know their only hope for success is to profit is to hop on one side or the other like fleas on a dog. The minor parties are only interested in getting money or a voice in the disruption.
Let us not be under any illusions here, if we submit now to not leaving the EU, they will suck our blood like a leach to deter other countries from defying the Brussels dictatorship.
I fear for this country if Brexit is thwarted. The march to leave could become a march to bring down parliament. Knowing the track record of minorities and malcontents this could be used to provoke civil unrest or even strife that would make the poll tax riots look like a tea party.
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
The EU has been consistent and principled from the start.

The problems are all with our own government.
Billythequiche
21st Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
I am sorry, I cannot accept that the EU has been "consistent and principled". They are trying to blackmail us into virtual slavery. Surely you cannot agree with some of the European Court decisions that affect our safety and freedoms?
I concede that a lot of our government have behaved appallingly. I applaud the PM for her statement last night. Her courage in calling out the culprits who are trying to defy the will of the people. No, no, I have heard all the arguments that we were misled and they don't wash. The people are not stupid and the question was simple "in or out', no qualifications.
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Billy I do not agree with Mrs May last night. She cannot blame Parliament. Like all leaders she needs to lead . It is her total incompetence which has got to the mess we are all in now.
Billythequiche
21st Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
I hear what you say but when cowardly Cameron resigned after getting a result he did not expect, there was no rush from the "honourable gentlemen" to take his place. They new it was a poisoned chalice and pushed her into the job without even a vote. She may not be the best leader we have had but she has been ill-served by her party, her cabinet(s), the media (especially the BBC) and her early advisers. You cannot criticise her for wishing to keep faith with those who voted to leave.
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Yes I agree to a degree but she never wanted to leave in the first place. Unfortunately the only major player would have been Boris and he is barking mad.
Billythequiche
22nd Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Ha ha, thanks for that. Needed a bit of levity, get too wound up by Brexit.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
The EU is based on the rule of law. Democratic principles. Non-discrimination. Respect for human rights.

Have you read the 2017 annual report of the Court of Justice of the EU?

I have. The Court of Justice does good work.

Yes I support EU wide rules for protection of workers' rights and judicial co-operation.

EU membership gives you rights.
Billythequiche
26th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
You have to ask the following questions:
Why do they ride roughshod over our Legal System?
Why do they break their own rules concerning countries like France and Italy?
Why do they try to blackmail and punish us for trying to leave?
Why do they only apply the European Arrest Warrant when it suits them?
Why do they ignore their own rules on first border entry or last border crossed?
Why do they allow some countries to flaunt agricultural and fishing rules?
Why do they allow blatant feather bedding and corruption?
Irene88
26th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Your comment are very amusing. My EU politics professor would have love them.
pip2
2nd May 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Honouring your commitments.

That's what EU law means.

The Dublin convention on asylum? There are new rules agreed by the EU countries.
Billythequiche
3rd May 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Don't think my professors were even aware of the EU, anything outside of academia was a mystery to them. Mind you, that was in nineteen hundred and frozen to death.
NeilT7
19th Mar 2019
6
Thanks for voting!
If I had £1 for every remainer saying "It was only an advisory" then I would be retired. One wonders if remain won whether they would accept the same mantra from the leave support.
Poppy1112
19th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
It will be €1 next year if we remain in the EU...
PaulineC52
19th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
No of course there wouldn't, If the vote was the same the opposite way round parliament would have sighed a breath of relief and carried on as normal. Those of us that voted leave would have been totally ignored. Well at least we have found out how much the people voting actually means to 'our leaders' . Remainers should also be worried by this. Basically we are all fodder to the mill, what we think means nothing.
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
What about the yes to Europe referendum result in 1975?

Ireland and Denmark both joined in 1973 and have had loads of referendums.

But a referendum means something different in Ireland, It's used for a change to the constitution.
Zorr0
19th Mar 2019
-13
Thanks for voting!
The PM should now tell the people they were conned into believing that Brexit was a good idea and that the Referendum was fundamentally flawed. She should also say that Article 50 will now be revoked.
Poppy1112
19th Mar 2019
6
Thanks for voting!
It cannot be revoked just like that... and there will be marches, riots in the streets by those who voted to leave.

It was approved by the Queen and written in law in both Britain and EU... Most people are reading the papers, listening to so called experts and believing all the hype. It won’t be so easy to get a full vote for an extension from the EU and the default is still a no deal exit.
seebee64
20th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Take it you are undemocratic and are for the EU dictatorship?
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Thank you Zorro.

The EU is based on principles. Like the four freedoms of the single market.

Approved by every government since Harold Wilson first applied to join in 1961.
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
The EU's democratic process is very democratic.

Separation of powers.

Co-decision.

Safeguards.

Have a look at "How the European Union works" from EU Publications Office?

Or "The European Parliament - the Citizens' Voice in the EU'.
seebee64
21st Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I have. Nothing democratic in the EU they invented a term democratic deficit where the EU was mega democratic deficient and the UK are only democratically deficient. Both the Commission and council are not elected and the EU Parliament have very little power. Perhaps you should look up the definition of democracy in the dictionary!
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
You are probably right-time to start again with a clean sheet of paper methinks!
Wilf
21st Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Better than Mrs Mays dictatorship!!
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
EU is more democratic than our own system.

For example.

In European Parliament elections every vote counts.
Billythequiche
3rd May 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
You may have been conned, those of us with a brain understood things clearly.
Judith358
19th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I think the country was misguided when we voted at the referendum. No-one gave all the information and true facts that we should have had in order to make a balanced and fair decision, there were too many lies and lack of clarity on the consequences. Everyone is fed up and confused over the whole scenario. This is exactly what we feared would happen. Theresa May wanted to remain but she has listened to the vote and has stuck by her guns to try to get a deal through. I think she has incredible resilience, strength and determination after all, she has been treading on new ground and everyone was watching to see how Europe reacted before they also took a similar decision.
Poppy1112
19th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I so agree with you on the resiliency of the PM but forgetting what the MP’s said during the campaigns to vote in or out, read the Lisbon Treaty which comes into full force next year. We will lose our country to Europe altogether. We won’t be able to make our own laws, or control our own borders. All EU countries have to adopt the euro next year too. It’s the EU who has lied to us...
Yodama
19th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
My thoughts exactly, why aren't people seeing it is the burning question.
pip2
20th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
That is a hoax and complete nonsense I am afraid.
ElaineF21
19th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
The Speaker of the house has acted correctly and stated the Deal cannot return to the house in its current form .
She will ask for an extension.
They will refuse as there is no justification.
She will then ask for an extension for a 2nd Referendum.
They will agree.
Extension they say for 2 yrs.
we then have to put votes for MEP. ‘S
Country won’t be happy.
Brexit cancelled.
Trouble on streets .
Trillions of £’s wasted that could’ve been used.
We are a laughing stock of Europe .
Sad
Poppy1112
19th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
She cannot ask for a second referendum even that wouldn’t get through the commons. To get an extension the whole 27 EU countries have to agree. This is unlikely so if her deal is voted down (even with changes she will have to make) the default is No deal exit...
ElaineF21
19th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
pip2
2nd May 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The other 27 countries did agree an extension.
Billythequiche
3rd May 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
A good summing up.
Carol6
19th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
The "deal" was done by civil servants who the majority want to remain in the EU. I believe the PM just signed the document and showed up when she had to at the negotiations just as a token appearance. All the negotiations were done by civil servants as all decisions are made in government by them. Ever wondered when there is a reshuffle of cabinet and a new mp is put in a position of authority of a department with no experience of what he is working on. He/she does not need it as it is run by civil servants.
Skattiecat
19th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Her deal is the same as remains in the EU!
pip2
20th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Um, I don't think so.
SRI55
19th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
My thoughts exactly.
Collie
19th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
I have to say just a few more words/comments.

I am married to a wonderful UK citizen for the past forty-five years.
We are living in Dublin, Ireland. Our daughter, has travelled the world and is now living in Malaga.

Okay, I have to ask all United Kingdom citizens please, have you thought about the six counties of Ireland, they belong to the U.K.

Those wonderful people i.e. farmers etc. share their livelihoods with neighbours who happen to live in what is known as the twenty-six counties i.e. Ireland.

Some of their farms/ roads etc. cross on to each-other, I heard of one farmer who has his farm split down the middle by this invisible UK / Ire border. Have you the United Kingdom spent one minute to
consider those people?

In the city of Belfast, you have all the Politicians. Who do they have in mind when they are making decisions. HISTORY! The time is now Now!

I love my family UK/Ireland and extended families for over forty-five years! Can you spread that same love and affection?

Am I making any sense? I cannot sleep (4.20a.m.) Will you be able to sleep after watching your elected government decide on your behalf?

I sign off with much love for all my family and neighbours I have yet to meet!
pip2
20th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I went to the Irish Border Communities protest in London. Have you met John Sheridan? He is a good man...
Collie
21st Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Hi pip2,
In answer to your question, no, I cannot say the name John Sheridan is familiar to me.
I am not very well versed on politics, more a concerned person
for peace and stability between all.
I wish you success in all you do pip2,
Kind regards,
Collie
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
Look up Irish Border Communities. I went to their protest in London last year.

They built mock-ups of the border posts there used to be.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Thank you, Collie.
Collie
19th Mar 2019
-5
Thanks for voting!
Do the Brexit voters know what will happen if this goes through?
I don't think so!

Why ruin a situation whereby the youth can continue to go travel
without all the 'red tape'.

It was our generation who voted 'leave' because we are stuck in the
past. We fear other cultures etc.

When all is said and done, what has the colour of ones skin, or what God they worship got to do with us. Can we not all live side by side
and giving one-another space to survive in our own way?

I want to leave this vote to the youth, it is their future and I for one, trust them to make the right choice!
Carol6
19th Mar 2019
7
Thanks for voting!
I managed to travel before we joined the EU. Funny isnt it, that we all managed before the EU and we were not ruled by an undemocratic organisation that wanted to make Europe into a Federal State just like Hitler intended to. I will not give up my country easily and be controlled by unelected beurocrats in a foreign land. Of course travel will be easy as it is in the other countries favour to have a tourist trade as a lot of money is made from it. You have obviously been taken in by Project Fear.
NeilT7
19th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Half of them cant even make their bed (If they can get out of it) and the other half cannot make a hot drink.
I am proud to be "the older generation" who voted leave
Collie
19th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Carol6

With regard to not giving up your country easily, Carol6 you are responding to an Irish woman, check the history!

If you are fond of red meat, if you leave the EU, you will no longer have our beef (we have the highest testing for chemicals etc. Your beef will come in from USA, etc. lots of antibiotics etc.

You have a lot to lose, we don't
Collie
19th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
NeilT7

Surely that is not the youth's fault, that is the fault of bad parenting. Pampering etc. I am very proud of my family,
Highly educated and now in their respective professions.

If you look on your children - adults - this is SilverSurfers
after all - as children who is unable to make their own bed
or make a cup of tea/coffee then by friend, look to your
own generation.

BREXIT concerns the following generations, not ours.
pip2
21st Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Eh? The EU is a shared organisation full of British staff. And 73 elected MEPs.

It's only about cross-border stuff.

The European Commission makes proposals. That's one of its jobs.

It's national governments and elected MEPs who decide what happens.

National leaders and their Parliaments in charge.
Joanne630
19th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
The country voted out and if your vote is worth anything we leave 29th march
Reen5
19th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
we voted to leave so we should leave on the 29 of march
pip2
18th Mar 2019
-1
Thanks for voting!
European Commission is appointed so it is neutral. It has a job to do.

It's national governments, and elected MEPs, who democratically decide what is actually agreed.

Please see "How the European Union works" by EU Publications Office.
pip2
18th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
My name is Phil Jones. I am a member of European Movement UK, Liberal Democrats, and Alliance of Liberals and Democrats in Europe.

The ALDE Party is the sister party of the Lib Dems in the European Parliament. ALDE Party is open to everyone world-wide.

I am the organiser of Pulse of Europe in High Wycombe.

I am commenting here because this page is mentioned in 'The 48%' group on Facebook.

Some of the comments below are just tragic, aren't they? The EU won the Nobel Peace Prize in 2012.

I was partly brought up in Germany. My father was in the RAF and handled nuclear bombs. He used to have to check under his car for IRA bombs. That is the Europe we used to have.

The EU is a force for good in the world. The first president of the European Parliament, Simone Veil, survived the Holocaust.

The only things the EU does are the things that national leaders and their parliaments have decided to allow. All published,

A beautiful democratic system. Everything agreed is published. Based on rule of law. With a court to settle disagreements.

An organised Europe. It makes me feel safe. It's a wonderful achievement.

Look at all the booklets from EU Publications Office. Look at all the things that help all the member countries.

In Brussels I met a woman who worked in the Commission. She said to me, "We all believe in what we are doing. Providing a service to member states". Sorry about the jargon but that's what she said.

She said "The UK has always been a highly respected member state. Especially in the area of fishing. Now we get this slap in the face".

So much misinformation. The accounts are audited. The accounts have always been audited.

The EU does only what is allowed. There has to be a legal base for everything done. According to the Charter of the United Nations.

What is wrong with some of the people commenting below?? They seem to be fearful as if they look out nervously across a Channel crossed in this direction only by bombers and doodle-bugs. Tragic. So unnecessary.

They use words like "no deal" without seeming to understand what that means. Look at 'Notices to Stakeholders' by European Commission. Look at the government's own reports.

Who are they, anyway? Are they even real people? Behind the button, no-one knows who you are.

Jean-Claude Juncker said the result of the poll in 2016 was a tragedy. "People say I'm a robot, that I don't have feelings. But I do have feelings. I am sad".

I admit my own fault. Before 2016 I was clueless about EU. I'd never even watched any of the debates in the European Parliament even though they're all published online with transcript and video. tinyurl.com/hapsdkq. That's the first one I watched.

Since 2016 I've been trying to learn about EU, trying to make up for my failure.
Lionel
19th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
If the EU is so benign, as you paint the picture here, then please tell me about the Lisbon Treaty? I allow some pointers below to guide your thoughts:

1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed.

2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s.
3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty.
4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.)
5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK.

And you believe all the above to be benign? A regional TV journalist pal, himself sickened by the BBC's bias, advised not to take any notice of what is on the EU website. Ask people in the street who live the EU every day. They tell a very different story!
Collie
19th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Pips2

What a breath of "fresh air" you add to this discussion! You underline the facts, FACTS.

I would gladly vote for you.
pip2
21st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Sorry Lionel but everything you have copied and pasted into your comment is already completely discredited.

You know I was shocked by the comment from someone who said "I cried when we joined".

I had to ask someone a lot older than me. Why would anyone think that? The answer I got was basically "fear of the enemy". Sad.

I went to the European Citizens' Meetimg in Kassel, Germany. Stayed with a host family who were wonderful. I'vd never been treated like such an honoured guest.
pip2
21st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
One green tick for you! 🙂
VivienneI
18th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
An extension will only fuel the remainers - we should leave on the scheduled date - a no deal withdrawal will make the E>U> realise we mean business
EdwardH49
18th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I would like to leave on wto rules
pip2
18th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
Does that cover flights, chemicals, financial services, medicines....?

Partly? At all? Have you listened to Sir Ivan Rogers?
Nunn The Wiser
18th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
So Mrs. Einstein (the present UK Prime Minister) has responded to the Speaker Of The House's ruling that she cannot re-present the same Withdrawal Agreement that was heavily outvoted in the House of Commons last week for another attempt at the same item. It would need to be changed "substantially".

So what is her cunning plan?

Believe it or not, to send a written request to the E.U. - ASKING FOR AN EXTENSION TO THE BREXIT WITHDRAWAL DATE! You couldn't make it up!

Not only have they reiterated many times (a situation with which Mrs. Einstein is remarkably familiar!) that the "Deal" is finished and cannot be reopened, giving a fairly clear hint at their likely response to her request, but also HER OWN PARLIAMENT HASN'T EVEN APPROVED THE "DEAL" YET! - which might lead someone of even pea-brained intellect to surmise that this hasn't got a snowball in hell's chance of saving Mrs. Einstein's credibility - let alone her political hide!

So, where to now, St. Peter?

A fallback to the "legal" position of a No-Deal Brexit on 29th. March. The one that NOBODY wants!

So - one of two things has to happen. Either Mrs. Einstein is persuaded that it is a far, far wiser thing to do to UNDO the legislation that guarantees a No-Deal Brexit, pronto! - or, surprise, surprise, by doing nothing, lance the boil of suppressed rage that has underpinned the entire Brexit debate for three years, and watch anarchy explode both inside the Houses of Parliament and onto the streets of the U.K.

It won't be pretty - but then Democracy has a funny way of showing its contempt for those who attempt to subvert it for their Party's own political advantage!

If not handled correctly, i.e. with common sense, it might even mean the annihilation of the Tory Party as a political force!

Watch this space!
AlisonS61
18th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
Yes a bad deal is better than remaining in the EU, but May's deal keeps us tied to the EU through Northern Ireland and as such is unacceptable. No Deal is better than a bad deal.
Uncle Tricky
18th Mar 2019
6
Thanks for voting!
I am not anti Europe, I am pro democracy. The European commission are an unelected body. If you dont vote your politicians in, you cannot vote them out. This is not a democracy, this is empire building.
Wilf
18th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Yes but the UK Parliament is worse than the European one. You may say they are elected-well we have elected a bunch of fools. there must be a better way forward for democracy?
pip2
18th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Like civil servants everywhere the Commission is appointed to avoid conflicts of interest,

The Commission makes proposals. It's government ministers, and elected MEPs, who decide what actually gets agreed.
shrew1742
19th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Absolutely. Agree 100% with that.
Getting on 46
18th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
Having just read many of the comments below it saddens me to see how many are quite intense in their support for a No deal exit from EU. Have they really taken no heed of the accumulated wisdom of experts that warn of the many negative consequences of leaving with no deal in place? Brexit is embarrassing! Leave could never just mean Leave and there has not been any consensus as to what form leaving the EU could take. There is no certain Parliamentary or public mandate for what Brexit means now so it makes sense to either put it back to public to vote on May’s deal or Remain or just to revoke Art 50 to restore certainty for businesses.
NeilT7
19th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
These so called "experts" keep saying the same thing though.
This MIGHT happen and that COULD happen
There MIGHT be this and COULD be that
The TRUTH is actually NOBODY KNOWS
What I know is that we can and will make the best of what is put in front of us
pip2
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
That's not true because one of the benefits of EU law is certainty and predictability.

If A then B.

That's not to be taken for granted. It is an achievement,
Nunn The Wiser
18th Mar 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
This repetitive diatribe from Brexit-supporting MPs regarding "respecting the will of the people" (their supposed Get Out Of Jail Free card!) might sound a tad more genuine if it hadn't been predicated on a RIGGED REFERENDUM - which, incidentally, is erased from the Tory Party's official version of The History Of Brexit!

Their version starts on Page 1 with: "CHAPTER 2: The Day of the Referendum Vote."

CHAPTER 1 had to be redacted because it would have meant having to admit to knowing that downright lies, half-truths, misrepresentations and serious integral omissions occurred, which - bearing in mind the closeness of the result - could have had a decisive impact on the outcome.

There is also the misuse of Party funding and a £39Billion Withdrawal Fee over which they might prefer to draw a discreet veil!

In summary, a thoroughly discredited EU Referendum which should be replaced with a fully-informed one-off vote, upon which DEMOCRATIC basis ANY result should be respected. No going back "until they get the result they want"!


Only then can it be claimed that the result is TRULY "the DEMOCRATIC will of the people"!

Which is the real reason why the Tories don't want to hold the 2nd. Referendum! They might lose!
AnneC912
18th Mar 2019
5
Thanks for voting!
I voted to come out of the union.I don't see why we need any deal prior to leaving. I wanted our businesses to be able to trade freely without intervention from the EU. I wanted our MP's to make laws, manage budgets and decide how best to support our industries in our countries best interest and be accountable to the people. Once we have left we are free to negotiate with whoever we want and who ever is free to negotiate with us.
PaulC89
18th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
I still think we should leave .but may as well stay in than take a bad deal that keeps us tied to the eu without having any reputation
Getting on 46
18th Mar 2019
-2
Thanks for voting!
Leaving with PM’s deal gives away our voice in Europe, has us standing behind the door whilst needing to negotiate trade deals with our nearest neighbours. The Withdrawal agreement is just the start of Brexit with decades of uncertainty to follow as we try to re-establish our trading position with the world. If the last 3 years is anything to go by I despair! The majority of young people do not support Brexit, we owe it to them not to inflict it on them. We should revoke Article 50 and stop Brexit!
FionaP71v
18th Mar 2019
6
Thanks for voting!
I have always wanted to leave without a deal and even more so now I've witnessed the bullying tactics of the EU. They only want us to stay because they need our money but we don't need them. We managed perfectly well before and given time we'll be fine again
Dake
18th Mar 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
A choice of the devil. We must leave the EU. I would have preferred a good deal, failing that, no deal, but if the choice is ‘bad deal’ or remain, then I’d settle for a bad deal
Margaret Hart
18th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
I would not have taken the leaving without a deal off the table as that was our strongest bargaining chip. I would like to know where our law states that a deal cannot be brought back to the commons a third time and why haven’t we heard about it until now. I don’t like the man, he is uncouth, sly andhas a voice like the most common market trader - plus I don’t believe what he said. The ones who don’t want to leave the European Union would be happy to go on having votes until they get the answer they want ignoring democracy. The ruling today flies right in the face of democracy.

We voted to come out of the European Union and if no agreement can be made in the next few days then we must leave without agreement and once again make our own laws and do our own trading as we did right up until we joined these Euro rogues.
pip2
18th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
There hasn't been a successful WTO round since the 1990.

Listen to Sir Ivan Rogers.

Flights, medicines, chemicals, financial services...

All either not covered at all. Or not as good.

EU is better.
PaulineC52
19th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
We already mostly trade on WTO rules, so does the EU.
pip2
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
EU makes arrangements with other counties over and above WTO.

The Japan partnership agreement is an example.

Which the UK benefits from.

As long as we are on the inside.
LeslieT
18th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
No Deal is still on the cards. TM does not have to accept the vote to take it off the table. Out Now 29th March 2019.
pip2
18th Mar 2019
6
Thanks for voting!
Stay in and let's vote for British MEPs with a good attitude.

I have counted 34 MEPs who are good ones. Out of the UK's 73 MEPs.

Catherine Bearder, Keith Taylor, Molly Scott-Cato, Richard Corbett, Seb Dance...

To name a few. There are MEPs for England, Scotland, Wales and NI.

Every vote counts. No wasted votes in European Parliament elections.

Cross-border issues? You have to work together. British law doesn't apply in France. That's why we have EU law.
oldsusiewalnut
18th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
Eu law doesn't apply all the time in france either,i was told we have our own rules
pip2
18th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
The European Commission has the job of making sure that what has been agreed gets done.

If that doesn't work then it goes to the Court of Justice of the EU.

It can be slow but it works. The countries of the EU trust each other not just for the sake of it but because there are remedies.
oldsusiewalnut
21st Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
only when it suits them,if you can afford the lawyers,and if you are young enough to wait that long
MarlowRob
18th Mar 2019
2
Thanks for voting!
For Heaven`s sake, please just walk away from the damned EU, pay them no more money, just leave, they`ll soon come running because they NEED our business. And if they`re so concerned about the Irish border, then let them sort it out.
The majority of people voted to leave on one issue- immigration, NOT the border between Ireland & Northern Ireland.
Now they`ll probably want money to delay. I despair..........................
shrew1742
19th Mar 2019
3
Thanks for voting!
I voted leave, but I - and I would suspect millions of others - certainly didn't vote leave on the issue of immigration. My main objection was being dictated to by unelected bureaucrats. And if one believes half of what is said/written, they continue to feather there own nests with the money from all of the EU countries taxpayers. Despicable people, and we the electorate can't vote them out.
I despair at some of the pessimistic postings on here. "DO YOU REALLY THINK THAT EUROPE WILL NOT WANT TO TRADE WITH THE UK " when (hopefully) we leave ??
RichardH274
18th Mar 2019
-3
Thanks for voting!
Any deal is better than remaining in ! At last we are getting rid of the EEC ! Good riddance to it and get lost forever !
pip2
25th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
It's not called the EEC anymore.

It changed its name in 1986 because of the Single European Act.
suetpud
18th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
I voted leave and leave we should with no deal,The EU have been busy spending our money subsidising their farmers, reducing retirement age in many of their member countries and it's time we used our hard earned money to invest in what our country needs . I resent being governed by an unelected group of people who have their own agendas. At least with our own governmentwe can vote them out if they don't do their job.
VeronicaK8
18th Mar 2019
4
Thanks for voting!
Very well said Snedker, you have hit the nail on the head! So many lies were told to the people. A united Europe is a guarantee for peace for my children and grandchildren.
Wilf
18th Mar 2019
1
Thanks for voting!
The leave campaign was all based on lies and the stay was run by fools. Not much of a choice!
DavidJ388
18th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
No deal is the best option as far as I'm concerned. There should be no deal on the table as we didn't have a referendum for a DEAL, We Voted LEAVE. NOTHING ELSE.
We have the confidence to work it all out after we leave with a NO DEAL scenario.
Gemini2019
18th Mar 2019
0
Thanks for voting!
We should never have ended up in this situation. Most politicians have no grounding in economics, and seemingly no respect for the electorate. We can deal with the EU as equals with no deal. Anything else leaves us as subjects of an unaccountable power bloc. If the MP’s haven’