Would you vote differently in a new EU Referendum?
An anonymous group of business leaders and academics is mounting a legal challenge to stop the government from beginning Brexit negotiations without a full debate and vote by MPs.
A recent survey suggested Leave voters are now experiencing “Bregret” – Brexit regret. Polling firm Opinium found last week that 7% now wished they had voted to stay in the EU.
Former attorney general Dominic Grieve said a second referendum could happen “with the passage of time” if it became apparent that public opinion had shifted. He also rebuffed suggestions that pro-EU supporters should not speak out now that the country has voted, saying that people in a free society should be able to dispute the majority view.
Silversurfers conducted two extensive Barometer Surveys and 66% of you voted to Leave the EU both times we asked you.
Two weeks later, after the Referendum on 23rd June concluded Brexit, David Cameron resigned, Boris Johnson and Nigel Farage who drove the Brexit campaign have disappeared, there’s a campaign for a new Conservative leader and potentially one for the Labour party too. The dust hasn’t yet settled and there is still uncertaintly. Both sides lied. But the one lie that will be remembered is the £350 million a week that will go to the NHS if we voted leave.
So if you had the chance to vote again in a new Referendum, would you still vote in the same way that you did? Feel free to express your views in the comment section below.
Would you vote differently in a new EU referendum?
668 people have already voted, what's your opinion? Yes - I would vote differently No - I would still vote the sameWhat are your views?
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxvFBBTqq64
Politicians .......I can't.!!! Also, Scotland is negotiating seperately
to remain in the EU, surely this will mean more delay while the ties
between Britain and Scotland are considered?
That wasn't good enough , so Cameron said he would accept 6 thousand immigrants over a period, 2,000 have arrived in the UK. Also, Cameron donated to the EU 6 million said to be paid to
Turkey
.
We joined the EC as it was at the time, and over the last 40 years the UK has become the second wealthiest country in EU membership.
Before the 23rd June we were the 5th wealthiest country in the world. We are now the 6th.
Domestic wealth formation - which by the way is a dreadful misnomer - was kick started under Thatcher. She brought rampant unions to heel and provided the financial impetus for industry and commerce to thrive. Now, I understand you were already in business in the Thatcher years. Thus, I thought you would have known that.
The EEC, and later the EU, have never been great trading partners for the UK. The figures prove that statement, and you do so like figures. We've run a trading deficit with them since we joined. Tell me I'm wrong, but with evidence.
To say we should hand over billions a year to be members of an elite trading club, actually it's a broken protection racket, just to make a massive trading deficit is nonsense. In your own words, you're a businessman, do you not see that?
And worse, to stay in that loss making club, the elite which heads it wants to rule this nation, notice the words here, rule not govern, we as a people who were never asked if we wanted external rule, are expected to submit to heavy handed diktats from Brussels? Diktats which daily change the way we live, whom we are required to live along side, the food we consume and what we may buy in our Euro shops, daily change this country so that it is unrecognisable from even ten years ago. Are you on something good again?
Roof Top, our agriculture is failing, our industry has failed, we no longer mine coal (no, I'm not a follower of those climate change fanatics), our oil was mostly used to fund unemployment for the purpose of providing a pool of labour for business, our own fishing industry has been raped by Europe, our service sector, the largest we now have, is about to be under cut by China.
Central planning failed spectacularly in Soviet Russia. It has failed on the same scale for the EU.
You may have made a lot of money from our being members of the EU. But you are in the minority.
Please allow me to tell you this. I was in a hamlet in Swaledale when the ship yards closed. I was still there, as a shepherd, when Thatcher closed the coal mines. We were six miles from the A1. For almost two years the people of this hamlet boarded ship builders and miners heading south for work. They slept on a settee, on the floor. We would feed them, offer a bath, give them our phone to call home to say they were OK. That's not just me, that's true of all the dozen houses in that hamlet. And we did that from a good heart, not a rotten bank account.
I've seen those men cry in despair, and comforted them. I had a two up and two down cottage. One night we slept eight men, as well as ourselves.
This was the EU. Oh I know the arguments about our coal being too expensive, usual drivel. I know the arguments about our ships being too expensive. Political speak to achieve an end - further integration with Europe. If you're willing to speak truth, Roof Top, that was all a lie!!
Roof Top, let's get a little, just a little, reality into your defences of our continued membership of the EU.
The EU was born in a lie, continued in a lie, we joined under a lie from Heath and remained under a lie from Wilson. There is no prosperity from living a lie!
We must live in truth. There is no other way.
Trouble with that though is when they have their referendums on the Exit issue, you can start all over again with writing your views for these countries not to leave the EU.
Just think about though it could keep you busy for years!
The leave campaign or 52%
It is a strange situation, the two main leaders of the Leave campaign Boris and Gove have both left the campaign in disgrace. The next two, Grayling and Patel are in hiding. The 2 MEPs that were involved, Farage and Hannan have now slunk back to Brussels. I have no doubt that they will continue to draw their salary and expenses from the organization they describe as corrupt.
The Leave campaign have left behind a victim, Andrea Leadsom. Andrea claims she would be able to run the country as the next PM. Andrea is middle ranking MP who distorted her CV to get into politics, massaged her city background to give herself credibility and has shown an extraordinary level of naivety when being interviewed by a journalist from the Times. The Leave campaign have dumped on her from a great height, her reputation will be ruined by this whole affair.
The Remain campaign or 48%
It is very strange, we now have a situation where the chaos and forthcoming recession caused by the 52% vote will have to be managed by the 48% vote who wanted to remain.
The same applies to negotiating the future of the UK outside of the EU. It will have to be managed by the 48% who wanted to remain.
I will not respond to a suggestion that a UK resident should leave the UK if they do not like living here.
Can they just not stop thinking about themselves for a minute and think about the millions and millions of YOUNG PEOPLE across Europe without a job because their Country has got them into so much debt and chained to EU.
I don't know? maybe one day hopefully, they might be thankful they can vote through the ballot box for the Democratic rights of their Country.
I have little doubt that if war was to break out, the younger generation would be queuing en-masse to register as conscientious objectors.
We don't have to be members of the EU for our citizens to be allowed to travel abroad, and those youngsters with the bottle to backpack usually opt for Australia. Europe is becoming a very dangerous place to live and to travel to.
But, I suppose the fools that wave REFUGEES WELCOME flags know what they are doing, don't they?
The tech stuff is the same as the equipment and software that thousands of oldies use to stay in touch with family and friends in the UK and throughout the world.
I assume your version of jaunting includes working in volunteer programmes in southern Europe, Africa, Asia and South America.
For me, jaunting is typified by Saga Holidays worldwide and Viking Riverboat Cruises. Self-indulgent holidays for the elderly with disposable funds.
Stop for a moment and think about the countries that have high youth unemployment.
Greece created its problems by not collecting tax. It was made worse by fraud at the highest level.
The strength of the Euro stabilised their economy. It is still in crisis but it is not getting worse.
Spanish banks invested billions into property on the coast. It crashed the economy.
The strength of the Euro stabilised their economy. It is recovering.
Irish banks invested billions into property throughout the country. It crashed the economy.
The strength of the Euro stabilised their economy. It is recovering.
It was the EU and the Euro that rescued these countries.
The money is raised by the European Central Bank and they raise the money worldwide just as other banks do.
.
The UK is committed to funding some humanitarian aid.
The UK meets its UN target of 0.7% of our national income on overseas aid.
.
If you want more detail go on line and have look.
The EU organises this process. The ECB raises the money in Euros. And the country that receives the money has to pay for it, it does not get the money for free.
Many weeks ago on SS I suggested rather forcefully I'm afraid, we should dismiss all our politicians and peers, as well as at least the top third of the Civil Service. Today, they have proved my case for me!
I cannot today see how a patched together Tory administration, a party which was, and still is, primarily for remaining in the EU, may govern this great nation whilst steering the ship away from political union with Europe. To envisage a pro-remain party carrying out the wishes of a pro-leave people is a contradiction.
Quite honestly, I'm despairing of the two party state we've had for so long. Rather belatedly I'm coming around to the view, we need a reversion to democratic governance. In my view that would mean a new party composed of people with no prior Westminster affiliations.
Here, I quote a man I much admire, Oliver Cromwell:
“You have been sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!.”
The remainers saying the market is falling are deluded the market has been falling since December all over the world, it's not just Brexit. the ones that are wooried are the wealty with their investments in the EU.
I could go on but don't want to bore you all. just hope Conservative party vote for Andrea and not Theresa. I'm not conservative so don"t get a vote.
You won't be surprised after my six weeks of jousting with Roof Top to know I voted out. It was a decision arrived at forty years ago and I will not change my mind.
May I suggest these hoards who want a re-run of the referendum because it didn't end in their glory put down their computer games where one may hit re-run and start again. This is the real world, a world of life and death. There's no second chance.
What's done is done ... let's get on with life in a Brexit Britain.
Now that we have a 52% / 48% split Farage has stepped back and said nothing more.
It is not as simple as getting on with life in a Brexit Britain. We are EU members for at least another two years and two months and maybe a lot longer.
Meanwhile, we have asked our elected government to negotiate with the 27 remaining countries our EU leaving the package.
And at the same time, we have asked our elected government to negotiate trade deals around the world to replace the trade the Leave campaign said we would lose by leaving the EU.
The only certainty we now have is that the next few years will be difficult and often disappointing and as always it will be the less well off and the younger generations that will feel the brunt of the 52% decision.
Now, if you are prophesying, as a product of inspiration or other insight, well ...
No sitting government does well in by elections, that's an historical fact. In a referendum, it would be, I think, much the same. How much of the leave vote was a protest vote? Your guess is as good as mine,
But I do suggest, it's a significant proportion.
I voted to remain and would vote exactly the same
But I say again, I agree, for us, the great British public, it is a major issue and one which affected the vote.
As one example of why we have lost all our manufacturing capabilities, why were the porcelain poppies for the display in London and Lincoln. Made in China. An utter disgrace. We still have potteries. Look at all the high youth employment and the failing Euro. Better to be out now than caught up the disintegration.
I don't know? all sounds a bit more like Dictatorship than Democracy.
I will say again, i watched 'Paxman in Brussels' on utube just by chance and i tell you, if the vote had turned out Remain i really, really would fear for our young people in the future they would have no say at all in the running of UK because there would be no longer a UK.
Hattie, I was twenty four when Wilson held a rather crooked referendum; old enough and wise enough to smell a rat a mile off. Now, having been a farm worker for twenty five years, often with cattle, I may say I can small the BS at an even greater distance!
In my time in farming I watched EU directives over rule generations of best practice, which had fed this nation well indeed; watched as we did things no rational farmer loving his land would do. The result is dead soil, drug addled livestock ... I could go on.
I have four step grand children, two of whom I raised from babies. Three of them are in line to go to university and I've caused a family row by saying we, us grand parents, won't help fund it. Why? They will emerge of three years with a piece of paper that's worth nothing.
I have a degree, in Geology, from London university. I paid for it, worked hard for it, but my heart was always with the land, with farms. But my degree is worth something. Hattie, we have young people working in our local Co-op with degrees. They slice cold meat, serve as check out people. I know them.
What is a degree in the EU worth? Nothing, I think.
In the UK, I've been farming in East Anglia, and several establishments in North Yorks, mainly the Vale of York and surrounding areas. I've also been in Eire in dairy, but that's another matter. Let's discuss what might be said to be a traditional farm, one so common just pre-War.
It would range between 40 acres and perhaps 200 at the biggest - the latter would have been farms owned by large estates. They would have several of them.
Always these were mixed farms; growing a range of crops suited to local conditions, as well as rearing cattle, chickens, pigs, ducks, geese and also some dairy. They were largely self sufficient, growing the animals needs on the farm. All the muck from those animals would be ploughed back into the fields in a cycle of what you take out you must replace. Now that's the key! In ancient speak it's called husbandry. One is a husband to the soil, cherishing, nurturing and feeding it and thus it feeds us. It feeds us what we need to grow and sustain healthy bodies.
During the War, and ever since, farms have ceased to be mixed farms. Bigger is better, or so the mantra goes. Thus they rely on artificial fertilisers for plant nutrients. NPK. Nitrogen, Potassium and Phosphorus, all the product of oil. But none of these have the trace elements the plant needs, or we need from the plant.
In constant use of artificial ,the soil is denuded of worms and micro organisms - they deliver the trace elements we need to live well. So, cutting it very short, farm produce no longer nourishes us.
Here in the back woods of Suffolk, in a very remote location, I have one twelfth of an acre food garden. That's a lot of land to dig with a spade and fork. Over these past fourteen years I've followed what I learned so many years ago - feed the soil. And I do.
Today the 1,100 hectare farm at the foot of my garden achieves two and three quarter tons of wheat per acre, using modern methods. On my first farm, a traditional farm, we in one year achieved three and three quarter tons per acre. That's a ton of wheat more using nothing of modern technology.
It used to be a cliche, the answer lies in the soil, but it is a truth. Feed the soil and you will live heartily. Neglect the soil, as our agri-businessmen are doing, and others will starve. If you're a city dweller, prepare to starve.
As for America, well, I do read Scientific American and it is the case, their yields per acre are worse than ours.
Summat's wrang .. and it ain't difficult to see what's wrong.